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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Every time I see that, "Vessels of Opportunity", my butt starts to climb up my back, my neck gets stiff, and I start grinding my teeth.

Could someone please explain to me, that if I make a living from fishing, or if I just enjoy fishing, and can no longer do that because of an oil spill, is it really an "Opportunity" for me, that I can now take my nice shiney white boat out and clean up frickin oil instead o fbeing able to fish. I guess it is supposed to be that BP is so generous in giving us the opportunity to try to clean up their mess.

I'm
 

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Very well spoken and very hard to deny your point. What really sucks is the fact that they will clear billions of dollars this year while finding some way to screw others out of the money owed to them. Aint it great.
 

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people should be careful before they take a paycheck from them...if they pay an out of work or some such person they might not be able to make a claim against them later. Im sure there are terms and conditions here.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I didn't finish my rant, I got so POed, and then realized that everyone else on this forum feels the same, or worse, than I do.

You may be correct on the claim. This is one that an attorney needs to explain. But, if you lose income due to the spill, then you accept work and money from BP, it may be argued that you have not actually suffered a loss. Example; if you can document that you have had 6 daily charters cancelled, and you take work from BP equal to your documented losses, it may be argued that you have had no loss, therefore no basis for claim or participation in an action.

I know the BP rep stated at the Pensacola Beach meeting that taking work from BP does not affect a person's right to make a claim. That is probably correct, but it may affect if there will be a recovery, or the amount of any recovery.
 

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What would you rather them do?

If you were the CEO of BP what would <span style="text-decoration: underline;">you do?

A law suit isn't going to pay the bills now. I doubt there will be a big pay out for the fishermen. I think it will sound good when it is settled for X millions but what will it break down to for the fishermen? The lawyer that files it will be getting rich tho.

I think that they are making an effort to try and help the fishermen by at least giving them something. There is no perfect solution to this mess.

No one know how this will all play out but as it is right now, the fishermen are making money. They can pay their bills, feed their families etc. The economy wasn't all that great to start with. If you remember correctly their were a lot of charter companies going out of business before a drop of oil was spilled. BP could have easily brought that up. I doubt any charter locally was filling every day of the week. I know I would drive by the docks at the beach and most of the boats were sitting there. Even on the weekends. Look around and you see bankrupt businesses everywhere. The charter business wasn't booming and BP came along and screwed it all up. There were hard times before this.

BP knows they have a mess to deal with and are making efforts to rectify it. I know a lot of fishermen that are happy to have an "opportunity" to make money during this. No, it isn't fishing, but it pays the bills and at the same time is an attempt to save ourselves.

I know a lot of people are angry right now, I am too. But there is no easy solution.
 

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Anyone who has a charter business that needs to document a loss of a daily charter, I will call your buisness DAILY, ask about a charter in the closure and if we can't go you can document me as a loss charter.
 

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I think the name "Vessels of Opportunity" was meant in the same context as "Targets of Opportunity" as in,it is an opportunity<span style="text-decoration: underline;">for BP. Alot of boatsmay be needed to assist in the the clean-up and these can be drawn from the pool of private boats that are already on hand as opposed to BP having to bringing them in from somewhere else. As far as being under contract with BP and not being able to claim loss of income... you may be right. I would certainly read the fine print or get some advice from a lawyer before I jumped in with both feet.
 

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One of the things that is kind of annoying is they are letting anyone with a boat in this, you don't have to be a Captain or affected by the leak to get paid.....I know some of you rec's here are onboard as I talked to some in line the other day at one of the meetings ...I have no problem BP paying you, but the problem I have is that it is taking that much longer for the guys who really NEED to be paid in the VOO to get onboard...Then the charters cannot leave the dock, but as an example these folks have their boats on trailers at their houses in the North end of the county.

There should be seperate meetings for the non-affected, or people who make a living away from the water or are not dependant on tourism industry etc... I know they may need you but right now priority should be for the people directly affected and going broke.
 

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On topic, we have been activated since friday and I put my claim in yesterday, the money is good but not as good as I would make normally....But the fact is the money is bittersweet due to the situation.
 

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The contract has specific language about what constitutes "onhire" and "off hire", but verbal representations of every BP rep lastTuesdayindicated you are getting paid from the date you are "activated". Of course the contract says, quote:

Article 10ParagraphA. Charterer will pay vessel owner for each charter term or services satisfactorily performed and accepted by the charterer in accordance withExhibitB . Any amendment or modification of this charter must be in writing and duly executed by both parties in order to be binding.

Article 25 Paragraph A. This charter includes any and allexhibitsreferenced in this charter and constitutes the entire agreement between the parties with respect to this charter. This charter cancels or supersedes all prior negotiations, representations, or agreements, both written and oral.... No changes, alterations, or modifications to this charter will be effective unless made in writing and signed by both parties."
I know several people who have been activated, Charter captains, and I hoe to hell they are actually getting to bill for each of these days right now due to as many trips as they have had cancelled.

Just a little math. LAst Friday the rep said he activated 108 people the day before. I saw probably about 100 people in line with the test activated. Just here in this area then, Orange beach and Pcola to Destin,

208 x average of $1,567.00 (based on average pay for different boat lengths) times 7 (tomorrowwill be 1 week for many =

$2,281,552.00

already, just in this area, for nothing being actually performed.

I amskeptical, but do hope for those of you activated that it's true!
 

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Clay - please answer a question for me. When someone contracts their boat and crew and is activated, does the flat fee based on the boat length also include the contracter and his crew and expenses or are the expenses and salaries paid in addition to the flat fee for the boat?

I called the BP info # and they did not know, said I would need to talk to the local rep doing the contracting.
 

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Thats the problem, no one, (talking BP's employees) seem to have real answers to a few key things.

In 14 years of being in business as a contractor, I have learned one very important thing.

If it's not in writing, don't expect it to happen.

All sorts of verbal statements can be made, but thats all they are.

Almost every contract I have signed, or prepared for a subcontractor to sign for me, has had a paragraph almost exactly as above in it, about no other verbal or written representations having affect, etc.

So according to some verbal statements, yes, your being paid for your boat from the time your activated. I would imagine, IF that are true, that no, you and your crew are not also able to bill for the $200 per day each.

I will be very curious to see the outcome of this.

And as I said before, I personally hope everyone who has been "activated" IS getting paid right now!! Would be a great thing. I'm just skeptical.

I wish I knew an answer. I was privy to a couple rumors of some things regarding this, which I will not repeat unless they are verified. My luck I would be on thereceivingend of a liable and slander lawsuit...haa haaa.
 

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Sorry, just reread your question and realized yiou were asking something different.

Answer.

up until last fridays meeting at Pcola Beach, it was only a flat fee, and there was a provision in exibit A for $200 per 8 hour day per crew for time spent in training, table top activites or meetings.

New exibit A handed out last friday, was updated, and now the $200 per crew includes Actual spill response".

boats under 45 allowed crew of one captain and one additional crew. 30 foot boat gets $1900 per day. Damn good money for the lucky ones that get it.
 

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UPDATE:

Don't know how I missed this before. But more of what I was saying.

ExhibitAParagraph2- Fixed Rates

A. Vessel Services: 1. Actual Spill Response: As defined ARTICLE 10- HIRE,ParagraphB1 Vessels > 65' $3,000/24 hour day Vessels > 45-'65' $2,000/24 hour day Vessels > 30-45' $1,500/24 hour day Vessels > 30-45' $1,200/24 hour day



And Article 10-HIRE paragraph B1 states:

1. For a charter term during an actual oil spill, the fixed rate per foot of vessel length (As stated in exhibit A) per day plus day rate.



Who knows, I have seen stranger things happen. Hopefully those who did get aqctivated are bankin it right now!
 

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So - the answer is?

Flat rate per day and that is it. Contractor must pay crewman and all expenses from that amount?

or

Flat rate per day + 200 for the crewman. Contractor pays expenses out of flat rate?
 

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Yeah it would help if you were a lawyer when reading the proposal. Just got back in town and picked mine up yesterday. He had a stack that was completed about knee hi in his office.Planning on going to The orientation tomorrow to hear what i might have missed in the read.

I picked a fine time to get my captain license......
 

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Go to the meeting and sign in to get your 4 hour course and be in the database.

But do not expect answers to contract questions from them.

When pushed on certain matters at last fridays meetings, the response over and over again was

"Seek Counsel"

Good advice
 
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