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Thanks for all the comments. We or they can do nothing and maybe loose a life or boat --or-- work toward improving the situation, now that we have their attention and a way to send them our comments from a large group. I am sending in the form-you do what you think is right.

PS: The new bouy is proposed to be the correct marker - not red.
 

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I think it's a hazard and should be marked. I don't see how anyone as a boater would not want to possibly save another boat or someone's life. There could be many scenarios where that hazard could come in to play. I'll send it in.

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Personally, I think theyoughtto do away with all navigational aids. I mean, come on,if you don't know were the channel is coming out of Bayou Grande or out of Cotton Bayou thenyou have no business being on the water. They couldsave alot of taxpayer money by just posting a sign atthe boat ramp saying "Warning: Underwater Hazards Beyond This Point. Proceed at Your Own Risk" :poke
 

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hypothetical question...what if one day you went out of the pass and to your surprise, there were 3 bouy's marking the ends and middle of the mass. Nobody knows where they came from, but they just appeared? Would this be a problem?
 

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jspooney (2/18/2010)hypothetical question...what if one day you went out of the pass and to your surprise, there were 3 bouy's marking the ends and middle of the mass. Nobody knows where they came from, but they just appeared? Would this be a problem?
Your suggestion is a valid one. From my past experiance with private buoys on sights is that they don't last that long. Either they are cut, stolen or wave action takes them away even if the are anchored securely to the wrecks. Those Channel buoys have at least one inch chain anchoring them and they are regularly maintained and changed from the wear and tear from the wave action. Ivan and other storms have moved the sea buoys and the Mass buoys in the past.
 

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the mass buoy has probably a 150-200 feet of 1/1/2" chain and a 12 thousand pound sinker. The buoy weight is probably another 16 thousand or so pounds.



I think if you put a welded steel pole on the Mass, someone would hit that!!



BTW, the Mass Bouy is a Flashing light at night, so when you see one of those at night you might want to start thinking.



At night I always come in thru the channel. A old smart CG Master Chief told me once some good advise when I was a new BM1. when I told him we could cut a buoy near Monterey CA and save mabey 5 minutes, He said that the CG spent alot of money to but that buoy there and were going to get our monies worth!!



All the boats hitting jetties and running aground, name one that would have happened if they followed the marked channel.... or been sober for that matter!! If you dont know where you are its time to stop...........



Rock on



BillD
 

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dockmaster (2/18/2010)the mass buoy has probably a 150-200 feet of 1/1/2" chain and a 12 thousand pound sinker. The buoy weight is probably another 16 thousand or so pounds.



I think if you put a welded steel pole on the Mass, someone would hit that!!



BTW, the Mass Bouy is a Flashing light at night, so when you see one of those at night you might want to start thinking.



At night I always come in thru the channel. A old smart CG Master Chief told me once some good advise when I was a new BM1. when I told him we could cut a buoy near Monterey CA and save mabey 5 minutes, He said that the CG spent alot of money to but that buoy there and were going to get our monies worth!!



All the boats hitting jetties and running aground, name one that would have happened if they followed the marked channel.... or been sober for that matter!! If you dont know where you are its time to stop...........



Rock on



BillD


This is the truth.



BUT,



A marker should be near the obstruction intended to warn about. I really don't think this statement is disputable.
 

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sealark (2/15/2010)They will never move that buoy next to the Mass wreck. Simple reason is if it was next to the wreck everyone and there brother would use it for a mooring and that is against the law. It was proposed many years ago after another local charter boat ran into the wreck. Plus all the charts have it at it's present location. It would be nice for safetyBUT...


It would be nice for safety? How so? What would be nice for safety is if all weekend warriors would learn how to read a chart for their



area of operations. Is is clearly marked and explained on the Pensacola Bay Chart (I can post the # for the chart if someone would like to



order one, Baker Lyman in NOLA does print on demand), Light List, and the Coast Pilot #5. It is the Captains (using the term loosely) responsibility



to have the knowledge and resources to navigate his vessel safely. The buoy isn't on the wreck because you are supposed to stay



OUTSIDE of it to navigate safely. It is a large wreck and a single buoy on top of it would not delineate how far to stay away, ergo a single



buoy that means stay out of this whole area. There is not an unlimited budget for navigational aids, they operate as efficiently and as



safely as they can. The charter boat hit it because he was on autopilot and catching some zzzzzz's. The wreck has been there since 1921



there is no excuse for anyone to not be aware of her. "Uhhh, I didn't know it was there," is not a reasonable excuse. If you hit it it is



YOUR fault, period. If someone on your vessel gets killed or injured it is YOUR fault period. If you are the Master you shoulder the



responsibility in total. So do everyone a favor and prepare yourself as if lives depend on it because they do. If this forum is populated



predominantly by people that disagree with me, mods please ban me.
 

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choppedliver (2/18/2010)
dockmaster (2/18/2010)the mass buoy has probably a 150-200 feet of 1/1/2" chain and a 12 thousand pound sinker. The buoy weight is probably another 16 thousand or so pounds.



I think if you put a welded steel pole on the Mass, someone would hit that!!



BTW, the Mass Bouy is a Flashing light at night, so when you see one of those at night you might want to start thinking.



At night I always come in thru the channel. A old smart CG Master Chief told me once some good advise when I was a new BM1. when I told him we could cut a buoy near Monterey CA and save mabey 5 minutes, He said that the CG spent alot of money to but that buoy there and were going to get our monies worth!!



All the boats hitting jetties and running aground, name one that would have happened if they followed the marked channel.... or been sober for that matter!! If you dont know where you are its time to stop...........



Rock on



BillD


This is the truth.



BUT,



A marker should be near the obstruction intended to warn about. I really don't think this statement is disputable.






Chopped Liver, you are exactly the kind of accident waiting to happen I'm talking about. The buoy is not there just for your Bayliner or



whatever it is you float around on. It is there to mark the controlling depth for the channel so that other vessels, like ships know where



the safe water is, it just so happens where there is safe water for ships there is safe water for you. If you wanted to cut the corner, or say



move in to the Mass to catch bait, a little knowledge from charts and pubs would tell you what the margin of safety is. There is no excuse



at all not to do this. If you can afford the vessel you can afford the $50 or so dollars for the appropriate pubs. I really don't think this



statement is disputable.
 

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Diesel (2/25/2010)
choppedliver (2/18/2010)
dockmaster (2/18/2010)the mass buoy has probably a 150-200 feet of 1/1/2" chain and a 12 thousand pound sinker. The buoy weight is probably another 16 thousand or so pounds.



I think if you put a welded steel pole on the Mass, someone would hit that!!



BTW, the Mass Bouy is a Flashing light at night, so when you see one of those at night you might want to start thinking.



At night I always come in thru the channel. A old smart CG Master Chief told me once some good advise when I was a new BM1. when I told him we could cut a buoy near Monterey CA and save mabey 5 minutes, He said that the CG spent alot of money to but that buoy there and were going to get our monies worth!!



All the boats hitting jetties and running aground, name one that would have happened if they followed the marked channel.... or been sober for that matter!! If you dont know where you are its time to stop...........



Rock on



BillD


This is the truth.



BUT,



A marker should be near the obstruction intended to warn about. I really don't think this statement is disputable.






Chopped Liver, you are exactly the kind of accident waiting to happen I'm talking about. The buoy is not there just for your Bayliner or



whatever it is you float around on. It is there to mark the controlling depth for the channel so that other vessels, like ships know where



the safe water is, it just so happens where there is safe water for ships there is safe water for you. If you wanted to cut the corner, or say



move in to the Mass to catch bait, a little knowledge from charts and pubs would tell you what the margin of safety is. There is no excuse



at all not to do this. If you can afford the vessel you can afford the $50 or so dollars for the appropriate pubs. I really don't think this



statement is disputable.


Mr Diesel, calm yourself. You really know nothing about me, so don't give me the "You are exactly bla bla ".



Sure I can afford the pubs. I am not going to have an accident on the Mass. I know exactly where it is.



All I am saying is there is plenty of "Markers" of various types all around this area, and all over the country, that are close to the item they are intended to warn about. Like the "WARNING ROCKS" sign near the channel coming out by the Navy Base. It's actually near the rocks ( gasp, what a concept).



I don't understand why there couldn't be some kind of marker, very close to the ship. And of course, since we are all smart little boaters like Mr Diesel, we have all read our pubs and know that the obstruction is not a pin point , but a big ass ship underwater and so we should be cautious within a radius around it.
 

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I can't believe there is any argument about this. :banghead:banghead
  1. <LI>There is a big ass ship sitting just below the surface within a mile of a pass used by thousands of commercial and recreation boaters every year.</LI><LI>It has been recognized as such a hazard to navigation as to be worthy of havinga bouy deployed and maintained to warn of its presence,</LI><LI>The bouy is not even remotely close to the actual hazard that it is suppose to warn about.</LI><LI>To move the already bought and paid forbouy to the correct location would require little more effort than is already being expended to maintain it.</LI><LI>In the interim between then and the time that the updated charts are published anyone whois not aware of the situation would simply have to avoid hitting the bouy to avoid the wreck.</LI>
I can understand that those use to the old location might be confused when they go there to catch bait andtry to find the wreck 300 yards to the north of the bouybut i'm sure that wouldn't last long.:doh
 

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Diesel,.... couldn't agree more. As a boater, whether licensed or not, you are responsible for the safety of the vessel. This means being familiar with the waters in which you frequently transit. There are a multitude of publications that are readily available to the recreational boater as mentioned in the post buy Diesel. I would advise mariners to get the latest charts, Coast Pilot 5, check the USCG website for weekly corrections to these charts.
 
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