[thataway]

Two months ago there was a flurry of discussion about lanuching ramps on Perdido bay, when Hurst Hammock was closed.There are no viable ramps for upper Perdido Bay and the River system. The Country put out a letter requesting property for sale which would be satisfactory. A "selection Committee" (I have been trying to find out who is on it and what their expertise is) was formed. On Dec 24 the PNJ described the properties submitted, and I list them below, along with my comments to Robert Turpin:The paper ranked the locations as follows:</DIV>1. 3.5 acres on Interarity Point Road on Tarkiln Bay,near Curzat Way (is this on the bay near Bayou Garconor ICW?--notclear from the paper) Theonly chunk of land I am aware of there is where thecondos were going to be built on the ICW--thereare homes on the Bayou Garcon side of Curzat. The Galvez ramp has currents which make launching both difficult and hazardous--this is also at least 16 miles to the upper Perdido Bay area)</DIV></DIV>2. 2.9 acres on Bayou Chico near Mahogany Mill (This is near the under utalized country paid for ramps at Pensacola Marine Shipyard. It is 30 miles to upper Perdido Bay from Bayou Chico. There is the no wake zone of Bayou Chico.)</DIV></DIV>3. 1.7 acres on Riola Place (Heron Bayou) (All of these locations are very small, on shoal water in residential neighborhoods--not at all satisfactory)</DIV></DIV>4. 1 acre on Weller Pl on Bayou Grande (25 to 30 miles to upper Perdido Bay)</DIV></DIV>5. 1 acre on Weller and Aileen Ave. Bayou Grande (25 to 30 miles to upper Perdido Bay)</DIV></DIV>6. 0.5 acre Riola Place, (CC&R--may strike it from the list)</DIV></DIV>7. 5 acres on Interarity Pt.Rd along Tarkiln Bay (Not sure where this is--but if on Perdido Bay, it may be a good possibility)</DIV></DIV>8. 0.5 acre Riola Place, Perdido Bay (All of Heron Bayou, Perdido Bay is very shoal to the shore, plus subject to chop if on the bay)</DIV></DIV>9. 26 acres near Meadson Road and Tarkiln Way (mostly wetlands)</DIV></DIV>The canal on Riola is very narrow--barely enough room to turn my 18 footer around in it. The depth in the canal is OK, but the entrance to the bay is what is shoal.Any area directly on the bay is too shoal. Even including these residential lots seem like folly.0.5 acre is not enough to consider for a ramp and parkingeven without the other problems with the shoaling.The current ramp on Heron Bayou is dirt, only room for half a dozen rigs at the best, shoal and under the 98 bridge with limited clearance--not a good ramp)</DIV></DIV>Since Hurst Hammoc has closed, recreational fishing on upper Perdido Bay has almost stopped. I live on Bayou Marcus, andwe don't see any boats fishing this area at all. The potential of a ramp on upper BayouMarcus at the EUCA site, is also unrealistic, because of shoaling of the bayou, wetlands where parking would be located, and snags. The entrance to the bayis less tha 15" deep at times.</DIV></DIV>I would appreciate any input from other members on the potential sites (esp #2 & #7) and if they are viable for ramps. We also need to look ourselves for sites for ramps. I am taking my boat and exploring the various parts of the bay which might have potential, as well as driving the side rodes looking for "for sale" signs. </DIV></DIV>We all need to contact our county commissioners about this need. There is 55 miles of fishable river and Perdido Bay in Escabmia county's West side, which is totally neglected by the country's powers. They need to be aware of our problems. I will try and speak at the committee of the Whole meeting on Jan 17th (if allowed) where this subject is susposed to be presented.</DIV></DIV>I was on the Marine Resource Committee for 4 years and chair for 2 of those years, and we struggled with trying to find ramps then. The Bayou chico ramp was obtained during this term, as well as several others on the Escambia River. We need more ramps--the property will cost more next year than this year. The contry and city have not been friendly. Several of us had obtained a commitment for $2 million in Federal gas tax rebate, for transcient docks in down town--it was turned down by the City Council a few years ago--that money is what was used for Tampa's recent marina re-developement. A portion of our boat registration fees is susposed to be used for ramps in our county--lets be sure it is used wisely! </DIV></DIV>Bob Austin</DIV></DIV>

 

[thataway]

OK, I have been invited to sit in on the "selection committee's" meeting on Thursday, the 10th.

Please send me any thought's about other locations for ramps on Perdido Bay, river system. I have looked at all of the above locations both by water and land. The nearest is 16 miles from the mouth of Perdido River.

This is a chance for our input to the County. If we don't come up with ideas, then we cannot blame the county if they act in their best interests, rather than those of us who use the waters!

Thanks

 

[dockmaster]

What happened to the talk of a boat ramp/pier near Bronson Field, off Bauer Road?



I do know some folks have approached the Nature Conservatory organization that control the land along Perdido River. Basically they were told, no way its ours..... Now if the County approached them in an official capacity, then they may have better results. That is the Counties job, so tho speak. I would guess, the old Hurst Hammock boat ramp was probably the most used ramp in the county.



There is some land near Hurst Hammock boat ramp that IP still owns that could possibly be purchased/or granted. It would take a little dredging, and planning, but not that much.



What about something on 11mile creek? IP may owns some of it and they have totally screwed up the water quality of the creek and Perdido Bay................ so they do owe us!!



As for the 26 acres near Meadson Road and Tarkiln Way (mostly wetlands) I'm guessing its: 08-3S-32-1101-000-002 BAROCO JAMES H JR & BAROCO 28.



This is right around the corner from my house. The problem I see is both roads in, go past Jim Bailey and Hellen Caro Schools and thru a residential neighborhood. I'm sure some people would not be happy.

 

[X-Shark]

I would guess, the old Hurst Hammock boat ramp was probably the most used ramp in the county.

Naw, Navy Point is the most used, but granted Hurst Hammock was used a lot. Hurst Hammock was used mostly for the 14ft to 20ft boats.

 

[bayougrande]

shoot i bet galvez has had it's fair shair of boats!!!!

 

[thataway]

Dockmaster, I will relay your comments to this selection committee.

Thank you. I did drive by the Meadson Road and Tarkiln Way parcel and what you have outlined appears to be the one. Although it is "wetlands"--it is the same terrain and elevations (for the most part) as some of the adjacent homes on the bay. We all know that "wetlands" arenot always consistant. The traffic would be mostly during school times, butmany of the ramps are accessed thru neighborhoods. That objection will be both valid, and often present.

I have not heardanything more about the Bronson field--but would be much better than other proposals. Thecounty attempted to work with the Navy in the past, but itdidn't work out. There is800 feet ofproperty withhomes on it for sale right next to the Lillian Bridge, whichafronts onto 98, but it isexpensive.The nature conservancy owns from 90 to Hurst Hammock--a huge amount of land-from the tax records.

I have also looked at 11 mile creek and the IP property by both boat andcar. I agree that approaching IP would be an excellent idea. Road access is currently difficult in this area. Alonzo Rd (acessable via Saufley Pines Road) seems to have a gate toward its end, so I suspect it is private property. I have taken a boat 2 miles up 11 mile creek, so it is navigable to this road head. The Northern side, is all IP land, and that seems to be in limbo, since a part of it would be "wetlands" if IP were to go ahead with the latest plan (blocked by the most recent law suit). Beulah Rd is narrow and marginal, but does access the North Bank of 11 Mile Creek, near the same place as above, 2 miles from Perido Bay. I have checked the tax records, and there are several different owners along Alonzo Rd, and IP on Beulah Rd.

I have launched and retirieved a 28 foot, 10,000 lb boat on a tripple axel trailer from Hurst Hamock--so it was capable of substantial boats at the right tides. It might be good to check and see if any other property in the Hurst Hamock area is available.The majority of parcelsleft there are small. But again, this is a remote neighborhood, and there may be objections. On the other hand, there are security issues in remote areas, so no place is perfect.

Surprise, surprise, as I was running the county GIS map along the shoreline, I found that there is a county owned park, listed as 1.67 acres next to the Pensacola Christian College boating center (South of 98,accessed by Spanish Moss Drive or Perdido Manor Drive). This is waterfront which is described in the County Parks section as:"Perdido Manor is one-half-acre undeveloped park located at Perdido Manor Subdivision in Perdido Key area. There are no recreational amenities at the site at this time!" This has about 62 feet on the water, 165 feet on Perdido Manor Road, and sides of 695 and 584 feet (approximately over 1.5 acres). I am not sure about the status of this park and if it is available for boat launch, but the water depth seems OK, there is no developement--and I don't know if there are any restrictions, but it affronts a current boat launch beach. So how many other waterfront parks are available? (for example Lakewood Park iks not, since it is owned by the citizens of Lakewood subdivision, deeded to the County.) But this, plus Lexington Terrace Park, should at least have Kayak launches.

The Escambia Co property GIS map is at: http://pa.co.escambia.fl.us/website/asp-bin/demapImage/main.htm?qRefSection=082S311011004001 This makes for some interesting "reading" looking at the rivers, and shoreline--as well as for property and ramp sites.

 

[johnsonbeachbum]

To clarify....

The county published a "Request for Letters of Interest" for any properties county wide that owners might be interested in selling if it had boat ramp possibilities. The RLI was not limited to nor meant to only consider ramp land that would solve the now total lack of Perdido River access. http://www.co.escambia.fl.us/departments/purchasing/documents/PD07-08_012.pdf

Many of the posts in these links also have some good site suggestions for Perdido River and Bay access.

http://forums.pnj.com/viewtopic.php?t=27667

http://forums.pnj.com/viewtopic.php?t=415

http://forums.pnj.com/viewtopic.php?t=31642&highlight=public+boat+ramp

http://forums.pnj.com/viewtopic.php?t=28621&highlight=public+boat+ramp

I especially like property number 36-2S-31-1014-000-000 right off the end of Bay Forest Drive from the south.
The water looks deep close to shore there which is tough to find anywhere on this side ofPerdido Bay.

If my wife was not in the hospital recooping from surgery, I would be there.

 

[FlounderAssassin]

X-Shark (1/9/2008)

I would guess, the old Hurst Hammock boat ramp was probably the most used ramp in the county.

Naw, Navy Point is the most used, but granted Hurst Hammock was used a lot. Hurst Hammock was used mostly for the 14ft to 20ft boats.

That is the biggest problem. those of us with smaller boats that like to fish perdido river and the mouth of the bay no have no where to launch in florida. sure we have the ramp at dogtrack rd. but if i want to fish the river i have to make sure that the bay is not to rough for my 17ft boat. those of you that fish offsore with big boats have nice, well placed ramps to use. we do not. not trying to separate the big boats from the small boats but that is the problem. atleast thats my .02.

 

[thataway]

Thanks, I have printed out all of the comments and linked comments. Also printed out some of the plots. The 36-2s-31-1014 is definately interesting--the major problem--as are many of the parcels, is that there is a large of wetlands. There is probably some high and moderate bank on the uplands part of this property (by 11 mile creek)--but may not be right on the bay.

I also walked the Perdio Manor property--again lots of wetlands, and it appears as if the drainage of the nearby "creek" may have been diverted. Still could be a small boat launch.

Too bad that the county does not have foresite! They are always buying and improving when the need is urgent, rather than being proactive and being ahead of the need.

 

[dockmaster]

I'm not an envioremental engineer but I think there are ways around the WETLANDS issues when people automatically start screaming WETLANDS the minute you look at land near the water. Granted their are concerns, but its not the major road block the layman thinks it is.

People are building houses next to the water and the world famous Bill Dixon International Park, with world class boat ramp was just built in WETLANDS. LMAO..............Well mabey thats why no one uses it, they dont want to disturb the wetlands!!





Ive been all the way to the school busses on 11 mile in my 24' with t top and it was no problem. I'va also been all the way up Bayou Marcus without much of a problem. The County could do a little dredging at the mouth if they need to and mark a channel.



I would just like to see the county do something for the boaters, and the smaller guys derserve the same amount of government support as the larger boats. I never launched at HH and probably never will, but the time I have been up the river, there are alot of boaters, and they come from somewhere.



I can remember building a boat ramp at the old CG station on Fort Pickens. All it took was a few cases of Miller, the Chief on leave , some oyster shells and that metal sand matting. Done in a day!!:banghead



Rock On



BillD

 

[X-Shark]

sure we have the ramp at dogtrack rd.

I launched at that ramp 1 time by myself. NEVER Again! Lucky for me a few guys came along after I had loaded, got stuck, unloaded, moved over, loaded again, then they walked up to get in the back of the truck for some traction.



Yep, I hear 'ya about the small boats. I own one of those too.

 

[thataway]

At the meeting with the selection committee, the committee members (country employees) only were allowed to speak. There were over a dozen members of the Riola St (Heron's Bayou) community, who were opposed to having a county ramp in their area. After the meeting there was some general informaldiscussion of the issues.

The summary of the ranking (which will be presented at the County Board of Commissioners Jan 17th committee of the whole, where the public cannot speak) will be put on the county purchasing web site the first of next week.

The good news, is that there will be an on going search for access to upper Perdido Bay, based on Monthly requests for property which is suitable. Apparently more properties have been brought to the purchasing dept's attention. The selection committee members realize that there is both a need for more parking at ramps, that the Pensacola Shipyard ramp, may not be perment, and that other access on Bayou Chico be obtained. More parking is needed at Galvez Ramp.

The real public hearings before the country Board of Commissioners will occur when there is a decision to purchase specific lands.

The suggestion that several small ramps be put into parts of Perdio Bay, because of the size of the bay and lack of the suitability of the small boats used on the bay and river that they cannot easily transit the bay to the river. The committee takes this into consideration.

I suggest that as many of us as are concerned, do several things:

1. appear at the public forum before the County board of commission meetings (I believe at 5:30 PM) and stress the need for ramps which will give access to the small boats for upper Perdido Bay waters and the Perdido River watershed.

2. E mail each of the County commissioners lobbying for the purchase of land to assure that we have ramps in the future and ramps to access the upper Perdido Bay and Rivers.

 

[thataway]

BillD, Bayou Marcus has a lot of debris in the water since Ivan. Unfortunately EUCA has refused to take any steps to remove any of this debris. That which has been removed, was done by the home owners, since the bayou canal was completely obstructed (and remains partly obstructed) by fallen trees from EUCA land. There is a fair amount of shoaling up toward the EUCA Plant, along with underwater trees. All of these can be fairly easily overcome.

Since Hurst Hamock closed we rarely see boats fishing in the Bayou Marcus area. The closing seems to have a significant impact. Agree that Dog Track ramp is very iffy if the boat is of any size, and lacking a 4 x 4.

 

[thataway]

I have sent E-mails to all of the Commissioners. I immediately recieved a phone respone from Dean Kirschner, who is Gene Valintino's aid. I am sending him a redacted summary (about 20 pages) of the comments from this forum about ramps. I also discussed the details of the need with Dean.

I also took my 18 foot boat up the 11 mile creek. Even though there was only 2 feet at Bayou Marcus entranc (about 8" below mean summer water level), I found no less than 4 feet in a channel going up 11 mile creek. This makes it one of the deepest entrances--other than Perdido River. There were 5 boats fishing up 11 Mile Creek on Sunday. Most of the lived on Perdido River or had launched in Alabama.

I did't quite get to the wrecked bus and multiple trucks which are on the South Side of the river (about 75 feet from the bus), before I ran hard agound--it is not navigable above this point, but up to there there is at least 2 feet. There is definately road accessable property which could be used for ramp construction and lots of parking. The lower land on Perido Bay is shoal out at least 100 feet, and is mostly wet lands, so that is an obstical.It isslightly over 2 miles up11 mile creek, and anothermile alongPerdido Bay to the entrance to Perdido River. This open bay could be a problem for very small boats. But on the day I was there, there were2 12foot jon boats near the mouth of the creek.

Iwill bring this property to the attention of the County. 11 mile creek is beautiful, despite the polution. I would hate to see it damaged by multiplelarge fast boats--and it is a viable fishing resource (don't know about the rumors of 3 headed fish caught there).

 

[oldflathead]

BOATERS VOTE!

There is no doubt a launch ramp is needed on upper Perdidio. Thanks to Bob Austin for following up on some county hired hands trying to take this issue in their own hands without citizen and County Commisioners input.I had a 2 hour meetingat my home yesterday morning with District 2 Commissioner, Gene Valentino regarding this boat launch issue as well as some other problems. Escambia County District 2 has about 55,000 residents, almost as many , as the city of Pensacola with only one elected official. Though Gene and I have some issues we do not agree on, he is working his tail off to listen to his constituents and work to resolve problems and he promises the County employees will clear their "high handed" treatment of the taxpayer with the elected officials.

The ridiculous suggestion to put another launch ramp in Bayou Chico, 32 miles from Perdido has been rejected. In my opinion, we have one of the best, but underutilized ramps anywhere at Pensacola Shipyard, plenty of safe parking, security for your truck and trailer and only $5, in and out, of course some cheap asses complain about paying $5. When I left California in 1988, the public ramp was $20.

Since most of the Perdido area is in District One, Commissioner Whitehead , you need to get his attention about where to put a ramp, and SOON, as soon as the tax reduction iniatiave passes and the County looses $12,000,000, there ain't gonna be no money for launch ramps. So, get busy, calling, e mailing, writing to Whitehead and tell him what you wnat, how much money boaters bring into the local economy and BOATERS VOTE!

STIR IT UP!

See what happens when you give a ******* a computer and screw up his landing gear so he can't walk..

Tom:hoppingmad:hoppingmad