Pensacola Fishing Forum banner

21 - 37 of 37 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
869 Posts
I had a LEO explain it as the "3-step rule"

1- step to open the glove box (backpack, bag etc. etc.)

2- step to open the holster

3- step to use the weapon.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
634 Posts
Oops, Thanks for catching me on that one Splitline. You are correct, 18 to possess 21 to buy. I think I've been setting a personal record for brain farts this morning. :dohI'm gonna blame it on the cold!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
101 Posts
CCC (1/7/2010)Foe some reason when you mention the "Step" policy some people get in an uproar, but it simply means you must make two seperate actions to get to the gun "STEPS" if you will, mine is loaded with one in the chamber in a holster in the glove box, STEP ONE open glove box, STEP TWO, pull out of holster = LEGAL.
First, I am not a lawyer, and anyone with questions about these issues really ought to contact one. However, I've read the past three editions of Gutmacher's book on Florida Firearms law, and I'd suggest that everyone do so, as well as looking directly at Florida statute.

I'm not in an "uproar," but I think that providing faulty information about a potential felony is irresponsible. There is no second step. It must only be securely encased. Loaded, unholstered in a CLOSED glove box is fine. My gun's always holstered, but that's a personal thing, not law. Where in Florida statute did you find the second step? Loaded in SNAPPED holster under the seat is fine. If you can't fire the gun without opening the container, it's OK. Leaving it in a container that it could be fired through (Gutmacher uses the example of a soft cloth bag) CAN, however, get you arrested. The second step is fiction. Securely encased means just that.If you must have "steps," it's one step: Open a container from which the gun cannot otherwise be fired(vs. just grabbing the gun from under the seat).

Of course, the best solution is for her to get a permit. That will solve your problems. Just explain it as a legal protection - she'll no longer have to worry about the whole host of potential problems with not having one. Explain that she doesn't have to carry, it just means that if you need to toss your gun in her purse in an emergency (eg, you have to jump in the water to save a little kid, or you have a medical emergency), she's protected.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
634 Posts
BIGRIGZ, There is no three step rule. I have heard that from other LEO's (Usually the older ones lol) I don't know if that was the way the law used to read or if it was just started to make clearer to people the meaning of readily accessible. If your gun is in the glove box, it does not have to be in a holster, might be a good idea though depending on how light your trigger pull is and whats rattling around in the glove box! I joke with some of the older guys when I hear them say thatbecause I've been an officer a little over 7 years now and I pick on them that it must have been awhile since they cracked a statute book, because the law has been this way since before I was sworn in.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
312 Posts
stonedv8 (1/7/2010)
aerialjc (1/6/2010)
The best way would be to have a lockbox that is bolted to your floor so nobody could get into it if they broke into your car. Some people say I'm paranoid, I say I'm prepared. :usaflag
Hmm, so the lockbox idea means that if a person ever actually needed the weapon, they would have to dig the keys out, fumble for the right key and then have to unlock the lock box and then try and use the weapon.

Now how is that prepared, in my opinion you might as well keep the weapon at home, does about the same about of good.
No tard, If your wife were to go to the bank for instance and couldn't take the gun in there shecould lock it up. When she gets back to the car she can unlock it and have it available.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
173 Posts
Discussion Starter #26
Thanks for all of the response! We have no kids and no kids are ever at my house so when we are at home we leave a loaded gun on the coffee table while we are watching tv. Now that my wife has a gun she can easily defend herself if the door gets kicked in and I'm not there. Also I like the fact that she will have it with her when going from the house to the car and vice versa. It seems lately (at least in Mobile) there have been a large number of car jackings in the driveway.

Just to add a rabbit trail to the conversation...If you were to mount a Fobus holster under the seat and snap the gun in (no velcro or button snap to retain the weapon just the clamping design of the holster) would that be considered securely encased?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
634 Posts
As an officer, I would consider that securely encased if it was in the fobus. I know the statute says snapped, but its not specified what they mean by that. They might have just figured the word "snapped" would cover all of the securing mechanisms that different holsters use such as velcro, frame locks, etc.
 

·
Praedator
Joined
·
9,924 Posts
Bluesbreaker (1/7/2010)Just to add a rabbit trail to the conversation...If you were to mount a Fobus holster under the seat and snap the gun in (no velcro or button snap to retain the weapon just the clamping design of the holster) would that be considered securely encased?
That would be a gray area to the statute that would be left up to interpretion of an officer or judge. Probably best to stick with the black and white and stick with a holster that has a thumb break. Most of the things that the statute talks about being "securely incased" refers to having a lid of some kind or a door shut like a glove box or a snap holster. But you can also argue that since the trigger is covered by the Fobus holster, that the weapon is not able to be fired while in the holster, so it is "securely incased". But that's a little too gray for me.

As some others have said, get her CC license and be done with it. Then she can have it anywhere concealedand it does not matter.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
19,480 Posts
Spend $50 for the class and $117 for the license and wait a week and she can put the gun where ever she wants and she will be legal.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,048 Posts
Hey mongo and other LEO...if I have a gun in my glove compartment and you pull me over for a routine traffic stop, is it best that I just go ahead and declare to you I have a firearm in the vehicle or just let you write me up and be on my way?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
634 Posts
Wharf Rat, if you have to reach in the glove box to get you registration or whatever, absolutley tell the cop that its in there. Otherwise, it really doesn't bother me one way or the other. I personally am a huge believer in the 2nd Amendment and this is the south.Guns in cars aren't uncommon at all around here. I always politely ask folks to let me open the glove box and retreive the documents if there is a weapon in there. I'd probably have another officer with me anyway just to keep things safe. If an officer asks if you have it in the car,tell the truth, you don't want to raise suspicion or escalate a situation if he finds out you lied about having a weapon. You gotta remember, until the stop is over and you're on your wayyou might not know everything leading up to your encounter with the police.For example, he might have stopped you because your car matches the description of some sort of suspect vehicle. You, the law abiding citizen, know you haven't done anything wrong or might think it was for a minor violation. Itusually just takes us a few minutes to figure out if we have the wrong car or not, but until then, we might not be telling you everything to avoid panicking what might be a violent suspect. Some of the coolest conversations I've had with citizens about guns have been when they told me they had one during a routine stop and I ended up looking at it and discussing it when all the business was done.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,289 Posts
When I was in high school, we parked on campus with our shotguns/rifles in full sight in the gun rack. I also carried a buck knife on my belt. Can you imagine doing that now!!! The hunting and fishing club took pictures one day for the year book and all the members were walking through the hallways with their guns!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
157 Posts
BIGRIGZ (1/7/2010)I had a LEO explain it as the "3-step rule"



1- step to open the glove box (backpack, bag etc. etc.)



2- step to open the holster



3- step to use the weapon.


If that LEO is a friend of yours, you need to tell him to brush up on statute 790 before he wrongfully arrests someone.



Never, ever, ever, ask LEO for interpretation of the law. Especially state statutes that overide any and all local statutes.(790)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
157 Posts
aerialjc (1/7/2010)
stonedv8 (1/7/2010)
aerialjc (1/6/2010)

The best way would be to have a lockbox that is bolted to your floor so nobody could get into it if they broke into your car. Some people say I'm paranoid, I say I'm prepared. :usaflag


Hmm, so the lockbox idea means that if a person ever actually needed the weapon, they would have to dig the keys out, fumble for the right key and then have to unlock the lock box and then try and use the weapon.



Now how is that prepared, in my opinion you might as well keep the weapon at home, does about the same about of good.


No tard, If your wife were to go to the bank for instance and couldn't take the gun in there shecould lock it up. When she gets back to the car she can unlock it and have it available.


If you have your CCWL, you can carry in banks. Concealed means concealed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
312 Posts
If you have your CCWL, you can carry in banks. Concealed means concealed.[/quote]

The topic was about his wife who doesn't have a CCW. And the lockbox was a safe way too keep the gun in your vehicle if you can't carry it into stores and such. The only reason you would want to lock up your gun would be to keep someone from getting a hold of your gun when they are jacking your radio, not for when you are driving down the road.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
1,613 Posts
Here's an interesting link from Wkipedia on gun laws, just page down to Florida......

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_(by_state)

Here's a cut and paste...............

<SPAN id=Florida class=mw-headline>Florida<TABLE style="FONT-SIZE: 85%" class=wikitable width="95%"><TBODY><TR><TH>Subject/Law</TH><TH>Long guns</TH><TH>Handguns</TH><TH>Relevant Statutes</TH><TH>Notes</TH></TR><TR><TD>State Permit to Purchase?</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>None</TD><TD>No</TD></TR><TR><TD>Firearm registration?</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>None</TD><TD>No</TD></TR><TR><TD>"Assault weapon" law?</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>None</TD><TD>No</TD></TR><TR><TD>Owner license required?</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>None</TD><TD>No</TD></TR><TR><TD>Carry permits issued?</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>Yes</TD><TD>Chapter 790.06</TD><TD>Concealed carry only; no open carry allowed, even with permit</TD></TR><TR><TD>State Preemption of local restrictions?</TD><TD>Yes</TD><TD>Yes</TD><TD>Chapter 790.33</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>NFA weapons restricted?</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>None</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>Peaceable Journey laws?</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>No</TD><TD>None</TD><TD>Federal rules observed.</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Florida is a "shall issue" state, and issues concealed carry permits to both residents and non-residents. Florida recognizes permits from any other state which recognizes Florida's permit, provided the non-resident individual is a resident of the other state and is at least 21 years old.<SUP id=cite_ref-42 class=reference>[43]</SUP>

Vehicle carry without a permit is allowed either in a snapped holster in plain view, or when the firearm is concealed if the firearm is "securely encased". "Securely encased" means in a glove compartment, whether or not locked; snapped in a holster; in a gun case, whether or not locked; in a zippered gun case; or in a closed box or container which requires a lid or cover to be opened for access.<SUP id=cite_ref-43 class=reference>[44]</SUP> (Note: this legal condition is not the same as "encased securely.") Vehicle carry without a permit is permitted when concealed even if it is not "securely encased" if the firearm is not "readily accessible". Vehicle carry on one's person inside a vehicle without a permit is not allowed.

Open carry when on foot in a public area is generally not permitted, but is allowed in certain circumstances, as defined in Florida statute 790.25(3). For example, open carry is permitted while hunting, fishing, or camping, or while target shooting, or while going to or from such activities.<SUP id=cite_ref-44 class=reference>[45]</SUP> When hunting on private land, or on properties expressly approved for hunting by the Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission or Division of Forestry, open carry is also permitted.

State preemption laws prohibit localities from regulating firearms, other than with regards to zoning laws (i.e., for restricting where gun sellers may locate their businesses.)

Firearm regulations are uniform throughout the state, and a carry permit is valid throughout the state, in all areas other than in a few specially-defined areas. These specially-defined prohibited areas include:<UL><LI>federally-controlled areas (such as national parks, inside the boundaries of which guns must be kept securely locked.), <LI>in or around specially-marked buildings/grounds (notably, mental hospitals and any hospitals with provisions to treat mental illness, where concealed carry is a felony even with a permit (F.S. 394.458). F.S 394.458 does state concealed carry is prohibited "unless authorized by law". Since F.S. 790.06(12) does not prohibit concealed carry in hospitals that treat mental illness by permit holders, it can be inferred that concealed carry with a permit is allowed. Caution is advised since there currently is no case law. In other words, no case has been referred to a Grand Jury nor has any person been tried for violating the law. One Florida resident was arrested but the charges were subsequently dropped after their attorney successfully argued the permit holder was excepted. Be advised each county's prosecutor may have a different opinion. <LI>any place of nuisance, <LI>Sheriff's Office, <LI>Police Station, <LI>Jail, <LI>Prison, <LI>Courthouse, <LI>Polling Place, <LI>any Governmental Judicial meeting, <LI>any school or college, <LI>lounges, <LI>bars, <LI>airports, <LI>professional athletic event, and <LI>any federal buildings or property. </LI>[/list]

As of October 1, 2005, Florida became a "Stand-your-ground" state. The Florida law is a self-defense, self-protection law. It has four key components:
  1. <LI>It establishes that law-abiding residents and visitors may legally presume the threat of bodily harm or death from anyone who breaks into a residence or occupied vehicle and may use defensive force, including deadly force, against the intruder. <LI>In any other place where a person ?has a right to be,? that person has ?no duty to retreat? if attacked and may ?meet force with force, including </LI>
deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.?
  1. <LI>In either case, a person using any force permitted by the law is immune from criminal prosecution or civil action and cannot be arrested unless a </LI>
law enforcement agency determines there is probable cause that the force used was unlawful.
  1. <LI>If a civil action is brought and the court finds the defendant to be immune based on the parameters of the law, the defendant will be awarded all </LI>
costs of defense.

As of July 1, 2008, Florida became a "Take your gun to work" state (F.S. 790.251). A new statewide Florida law went into effect on this date prohibiting most businesses from firing any employee with a Concealed Weapon License for keeping a legal firearm locked in their car in the company parking lot. The purpose of the new law is to allow CWL holders to exercise their Second Amendment rights during their commutes to and from work. Exceptions listed in F.S. 790.251(7) include school property, correctional institutions, property where a nuclear-powered electricity generation facility is located, property upon which substantial activities involving national defense, aerospace, or homeland security are conducted, property upon which the primary business conducted is the manufacture, use, storage, or transportation of combustible or explosive materials, a motor vehicle owned/leased/rented by your employer, and any other property upon which possession of a firearm is prohibited pursuant to any federal law, contract with a federal government entity, or general law of Florida. Currently, a test case involving Walt Disney World Resort is going through the courts, involving a former Disney security guard who was fired, despite having a CWL, for having a firearm locked in his car on July 1, in violation of Disney's pre-existing and strict no weapons allowed policy. Disney claims that they are exempt from the new state law, on the basis of their having a fireworks license for conducting nightly fireworks shows at Disney World.<SUP id=cite_ref-45 class=reference>[46]</SUP><SUP id=cite_ref-46 class=reference>[47]</SUP>

Florida law allows private firearm sales between residents without requiring any processing through an FFL. Florida law also permits larger municipalities to elect to require a concealed carry permit for a buyer to purchase a gun at a gun show from another private individual without any delay, but in practice, this applies only to a few of the largest municipalities (Miami, Orlando, etc.) where it has been invoked.

Currently, Florida's Concealed Weapon License is one of the most widely-recognized, state-issued concealed weapon permit. The resident Florida Concealed Weapon License is recognized in thirty-three different states, while the non-resident Florida Concealed Weapon License is recognized in twenty-seven states.<SUP id=cite_ref-47 class=reference>[48]</SUP>
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21 Posts
bluffman2 (1/6/2010)iknow we are talking hand guns. but what happened to the good old days of having 2 shotguns/rifles loaded to the brim on the gun rack on the back window of your truck?



i MISS THOSE DAYS


In Texas people still do this I had my 30-30 beside me at all times and my shot gun was behind the seat 90% of the time. I would still be carrying them but you must be 21+ to carry a firearm or so ive been told. If I'm mistaken please let me know id feel a lot safer with my rifle in my truck.



:usaflag
 
21 - 37 of 37 Posts
Top