CCL info. please help. - Page 6

Capt Ron · 02-07-2012, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glassplus

Capt. Ron Yes you did attend that class, I was one of the inst. at that class and I know how you allowed to attend.(oh GEG said hi) . The class was put on by GSTC and not by ECSO That was one reason you were allowed and if I remember you went to the school board saying you were trying to get your K- license. and that would help you. That cert is good for two things one is just to say you attend the class and the other is to get a ccl I thank,you can correct me If I'm wrong. I will take you on a Shoot and several more said they would probably show up to. Any one that knows me know that I'm willing to burn some power any time in any thing.I have a quiet place to shoot with all kind of targets. Even better why don't you come and shoot the South East IPSC match in FROST PROOF Florida I will be there. If not I will make it a point to get up with you when I get back. I'm such that we can learn something from you. I'm always up to learning. An I have probably have enough cert.to cover your wall from my 40+ yrs of shooting and training,I don't have any of them on my wall, as you said a cert doesn't make a good inst. I don't tell many but I have been In two shooting incidents, one came out good and the other cost me alot of money so I have been there was not on the job, was personal protection. I would not have a 12yr old shooting a 12ga 3in mag. against a wall. I could go on but I'm retired and not suppose to work this hard. jj

I'd like to hear about your shooting incidences so that I may share them with my students from someone who has experienced it first hand. I have avoided every incident I could over the 20 years I have been able to carry simply because I learned that a ccw license is a license to run away with pride! Living in the heart of Warrington and being a landlord for over 10 years I have had nearly a dozen incidences that I believe I could have used deadly force without much legal fear and 5 incidences where for "sure" I would have barely even been questioned, but my nature is to avoid headaches or possible headaches whenever I can. I teach my students that retreating is always a respectable option as well, but when you can't retreat, don't miss!
My range is very quiet also with no other shooters other than ourselves. I have over 40 zoned acres to play on in the farm country. I'd also like to see how your shooting styles and techniques have changed over the years as the training has changed for you. I'm guessing you transitioned from revolver to semi-auto during your career. I don't try to change anyones shooting style(especially my more experienced students) unless they want to change. I simply focus deeper on the fundamentals that apply to all grips and stances, etc.

I also believe, no matter what your grip, firearm, or position is that a clear front sight on the center of blurr is still the center of a blurr.

As far as IPSC, weekends are my bill paying days or I would be at ERML doing IDPA. I have a bunch of steel targets and plates, but no movers yet. When the extra funds allow I'd like to get some for the range.

Let me know when you get back.

Perhaps I need to host a small tourney for PFF. I have a huge pit for all the probable BS to flow into!

helo_hunter · 02-07-2012, 04:24 PM

Like Ron said, there are a number of instructors on the PFF site who teach part time. Lots of experience on the Forum.
For example, I have been a NRA Certified Instructor since 1987, teach nowadays with a partner and with ERML. Before that, taught firearms orientation (safety and marksmanship) at the Naval Academy in 1977. I have a full time job with the Navy so most of my instruction is on the weekends.
Like to shoot with others for fun and to learn just how much I don't know.

Burnt Drag · 02-07-2012, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capt Ron

If you aren't pre-registerd/committed to the class tomorrow night and you want to keep your money inside Florida, there are instructors here on the PFF that can probably do it for $75.00 also if you ask.

If you don't have an appointment with dept of ag already, you have about normally two weeks to get a class first.

Did Styx raise their price or is it a different class?
I thought Tony normally does an NRA Basic pistol class for $50.00. I don't think anyone here does it for that price on a regular basis.

Please let us know the details of the class when your done so that I can share the info with people who's first question is: How much is your class?

If you don't train with me, train with a PFF member instructor, if not a PFF member, at least a local guy in Florida.
Like a family we all don't have to get along or like each other, but we should at least keep the money in the family.
Just my opinion.

Well Ron, others, the class was excellent. BTW, these folks are "family",
they have offered great service as I shoot trap, skeet, and 5 stand there often. I've purchased ammo, reloading stuff, and never had a bad moment there. The first part of the class covered things that I was already familier... pistol operation, revolver operation, ammo type, bullet type, Safety, safety, safety, and more safety. We all handled the weapons, single action revolver, double action revolver, single action pistol, DA pistol..etc.. Sight picture, trigger squeeze.. stance etc. Dominant eye ID.
and then we went out and shot our weapons. All 18 of us. There were 3 instructors so, things went faster. What I observed were 4 young women (under 40) 6 women in their 60s 5 guys over 60 and 3 guys under 50. There were at least 8 of the group that had very little experience with hand guns. These fellows did a fine job and one redheaded lady put 5 rounds into the 10 ring. I would hate to break into her house. After class, our instructor gave some more very valueable safety advice. There was some stuff he talked about that I had'nt given much thought to. AND>>>>
I got to get some primers, a shell holder, and some de-capping pins for my dies. I'll give them an A. Not an A+ because Cameron Diaz wasn't there.

Capt Ron · 02-07-2012, 11:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burnt Drag

Well Ron, others, the class was excellent. BTW, these folks are "family",
they have offered great service as I shoot trap, skeet, and 5 stand there often. I've purchased ammo, reloading stuff, and never had a bad moment there. The first part of the class covered things that I was already familier... pistol operation, revolver operation, ammo type, bullet type, Safety, safety, safety, and more safety. We all handled the weapons, single action revolver, double action revolver, single action pistol, DA pistol..etc.. Sight picture, trigger squeeze.. stance etc. Dominant eye ID.
and then we went out and shot our weapons. All 18 of us. There were 3 instructors so, things went faster. What I observed were 4 young women (under 40) 6 women in their 60s 5 guys over 60 and 3 guys under 50. There were at least 8 of the group that had very little experience with hand guns. These fellows did a fine job and one redheaded lady put 5 rounds into the 10 ring. I would hate to break into her house. After class, our instructor gave some more very valueable safety advice. There was some stuff he talked about that I had'nt given much thought to. AND>>>>
I got to get some primers, a shell holder, and some de-capping pins for my dies. I'll give them an A. Not an A+ because Cameron Diaz wasn't there.

Well, I'm sure everyone here in the PFF family understands you keeping the money in your family too

How long was the class and how many rounds were required to shoot?

Was it actually an NRA Class?
Was an NRA certificate issued? Some of my students need specifically an NRA certificate for their other home state.

I really Like Brad and Russell there also. I actually miss Hearing Richard the RSO yell, "Two seconds in between shots people! No rapid fire!!!"

Firefishvideo · 02-08-2012, 08:33 AM

Congrats, Burnt Drag. I Think it would be very helpful to the rest if you would be so kind as to let us know a few more details of the class. Mainly:
-How many rounds you fired
-were you able to practice "double taps" or just slow single "target style shooting".
-If you actually fired the other weapons or just "handled" them.
- If you were introduced to or practiced procedures for failures in auto pistols ....( failures to fire/failure to feed/double feed)
These points (mainly the last one) can be VERY important and would give us a good idea of what you get for the price.
Thanks, Scott.

Burnt Drag · 02-08-2012, 01:08 PM

Thanks Scott,
You must remember that this is the basic NRA "introduction" to handguns and is required for the CC permit. We will get a completion certificate by saturday. The instructor did'nt get into any "advanced" subjects like clearing jams. That would come in an advanced course. We covered stances, and such. With some of the women in this course, (at this point) I would'nt want to be standing near them as they attempted to clear any sort of weapon. I did some "rapid" fire, not too rapid, I wanted to be precise. As far as number of rounds fired, I personally shot about 30.
Some of the folks shot more, some less. We were welcome to fire any of the weapons there, but I shoot a good bit with my Mk 1, less with my Bersa, and have been since I was in my teens, so there was no real novelty in shooting anything there. I had an FFL from 1982-1991, so I shot just about everything from 1911s to
Dirty Harry guns. Range safety was another important thing that I saw taught. For many it was their first time at a range, and the range etiquette taught on that subject was real important. Oh, the class began at 5:30 and was over at 9:15. The instructors advised, pleaded, emphesized the important of practice. You folks should have seen the shakey hands... trigger snatching... etc. I think the instructors did a fine job of taking these people who were ignorant aside and giving advice, and technique instruction. Tony told them that they needed to practice at least once a month. Any other questions?

ace529 · 02-08-2012, 01:26 PM

Capt Ron.....do you allow people to shoot on your property for a fee or is it only your students who are allowed to shoot?

Capt Ron · 02-08-2012, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ace529

Capt Ron.....do you allow people to shoot on your property for a fee or is it only your students who are allowed to shoot?

ACE,
I have to be there whenever anyone shoots, because it's a clause in my insurance.

I usually do a one hour or two hour session at $60 per hour.
You can split a 2 hr session ($120)with your buddy, so he basically pays for your time while youre reloading and he's shooting. I only allow one shooter at a time typically..

All my guns are available at no extra charge, you simply bring the ammo for them if you want to shoot. I don't supply ammo for range time(CCW classes only).

If your looking to just plink...it's pretty expensive. If you're looking to train to the next level, it's the best deal around. Your training satisfaction is guaranteed if I can't help you improve your shooting.

Clay-Doh · 02-08-2012, 02:46 PM

Ron, seems like you got a couple that just find all your threads or post to pick you apart. Who's Wheaties did you piss in brother? ha ha.

Whenever you and Stacey are up to get some diving in let me know and we'll get out.

By the way...all the lead you deal with, and I guess lead in the Milton drinking water? explain a lot about you.

Talk to you soon

Firefishvideo · 02-08-2012, 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burnt Drag

Thanks Scott,
You must remember that this is the basic NRA "introduction" to handguns and is required for the CC permit. We will get a completion certificate by saturday. The instructor did'nt get into any "advanced" subjects like clearing jams. That would come in an advanced course. We covered stances, and such. With some of the women in this course, (at this point) I would'nt want to be standing near them as they attempted to clear any sort of weapon. I did some "rapid" fire, not too rapid, I wanted to be precise. As far as number of rounds fired, I personally shot about 30.
Some of the folks shot more, some less. We were welcome to fire any of the weapons there, but I shoot a good bit with my Mk 1, less with my Bersa, and have been since I was in my teens, so there was no real novelty in shooting anything there. I had an FFL from 1982-1991, so I shot just about everything from 1911s to
Dirty Harry guns. Range safety was another important thing that I saw taught. For many it was their first time at a range, and the range etiquette taught on that subject was real important. Oh, the class began at 5:30 and was over at 9:15. The instructors advised, pleaded, emphesized the important of practice. You folks should have seen the shakey hands... trigger snatching... etc. I think the instructors did a fine job of taking these people who were ignorant aside and giving advice, and technique instruction. Tony told them that they needed to practice at least once a month. Any other questions?

Thanks...That was the first informative post I have seen on one of the classes...(other than Ron's). When I was working on getting my permit, I took Ron's 4 hour course.....It was about $100 more than the one you described......I Thought I got a good deal, and now I know I did. Ron provides the ammo for the class, and I think I burned through $60+ worth of ammo by the end of the class (200 rounds of 9mm + several revolver calibers+Shotgun+countless .22 rounds put through the Glock conversions.) Ron's .22 conversions are purposely poor performers...and jam every few shots. This forced me to learn to clear jams and correct problems quickly....something someone that relies on an auto loading pistol should know. I also was able to try out the myriad of firearms Ron has on hand, including his personal carry ....the Kahr p380. This was valuable experience to someone who had NOT been around handguns, and needed the one on one training to hammer out the bad habits before they got engrained. In the end I went home TIRED....sore arms and trigger finger....but I had a great base, and knew what I needed to practice, and what is SHOULD look like....I Don't think most people will ever take a second class and I just wish that When I urged people to consider something besides the basic , cheapest class, that they understood what they are missing out on.
Sounds like YOU already had a good background so you may have already been exposed to a lot of the stuff in a more expensive class. Thanks again for the info...I think it would help a lot if people could look at what they were getting in one class vs another instead of just $80 vs $180.

02-07-2012, 04:24 PM	#52
helo_hunter Senior Member Snapper Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Pace, FL or Sherman Cove or in the woods Posts: 407	Like Ron said, there are a number of instructors on the PFF site who teach part time. Lots of experience on the Forum. For example, I have been a NRA Certified Instructor since 1987, teach nowadays with a partner and with ERML. Before that, taught firearms orientation (safety and marksmanship) at the Naval Academy in 1977. I have a full time job with the Navy so most of my instruction is on the weekends. Like to shoot with others for fun and to learn just how much I don't know. __________________ NRA Training Counselor and Certified Instructor for Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, Personal Protection in the Home, Personal Protection Outside the Home, Home Firearms Safety, Chief Range Safety Officer and Refuse To Be A Victim

02-08-2012, 08:33 AM	#55
Firefishvideo Videographer Grouper Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Pensacola, FL Posts: 837	Congrats, Burnt Drag. I Think it would be very helpful to the rest if you would be so kind as to let us know a few more details of the class. Mainly: -How many rounds you fired -were you able to practice "double taps" or just slow single "target style shooting". -If you actually fired the other weapons or just "handled" them. - If you were introduced to or practiced procedures for failures in auto pistols ....( failures to fire/failure to feed/double feed) These points (mainly the last one) can be VERY important and would give us a good idea of what you get for the price. Thanks, Scott. __________________ www.firefishvideo.com

02-08-2012, 02:46 PM	#59
Clay-Doh Senior Member Blue Marlin Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Gulf Breeze, or 100' Deep on a Wreck With a Gun! Posts: 4,832	Ron, seems like you got a couple that just find all your threads or post to pick you apart. Who's Wheaties did you piss in brother? ha ha. Whenever you and Stacey are up to get some diving in let me know and we'll get out. By the way...all the lead you deal with, and I guess lead in the Milton drinking water? explain a lot about you. Talk to you soon __________________ SO EASY A CAVEMAN CAN DO IT. MY UNDERWATER SPEARFISHING VIDEOS

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02-08-2012, 01:08 PM	#56
Burnt Drag Senior Member Grouper Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 708	Thanks Scott, You must remember that this is the basic NRA "introduction" to handguns and is required for the CC permit. We will get a completion certificate by saturday. The instructor did'nt get into any "advanced" subjects like clearing jams. That would come in an advanced course. We covered stances, and such. With some of the women in this course, (at this point) I would'nt want to be standing near them as they attempted to clear any sort of weapon. I did some "rapid" fire, not too rapid, I wanted to be precise. As far as number of rounds fired, I personally shot about 30. Some of the folks shot more, some less. We were welcome to fire any of the weapons there, but I shoot a good bit with my Mk 1, less with my Bersa, and have been since I was in my teens, so there was no real novelty in shooting anything there. I had an FFL from 1982-1991, so I shot just about everything from 1911s to Dirty Harry guns. Range safety was another important thing that I saw taught. For many it was their first time at a range, and the range etiquette taught on that subject was real important. Oh, the class began at 5:30 and was over at 9:15. The instructors advised, pleaded, emphesized the important of practice. You folks should have seen the shakey hands... trigger snatching... etc. I think the instructors did a fine job of taking these people who were ignorant aside and giving advice, and technique instruction. Tony told them that they needed to practice at least once a month. Any other questions?

02-08-2012, 01:26 PM	#57
ace529 Member Ruby Red Lip Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: pensacola Posts: 56	Capt Ron.....do you allow people to shoot on your property for a fee or is it only your students who are allowed to shoot?

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