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Wetlands ? - if I see lily pads with white flowers

3K views 20 replies 13 participants last post by  standrew 
#1 ·
amongst them is that an indicator of a wetland?
 
#3 ·
You need evidence of of few thing to determine a wetland. One, a dominance of wetland plant (either labelled obligate, facultative wet, or facultative by the FDEP or the Army Corps), two, hydrologic patterns (water marks on trees, rack lines, drainage patterns etc), and hydric soils. A combination of two of these factors usually constitutes a wetland. As stated above, pitcher plant praries are wetland s that routinely do not hold water. If you dug a hole in a prarie and see reducing and oxidizing characteristics in the top 6" (looks like rust in the soil), you are usually standing in what would be considered a regulated wetland. There is obviously a lot more involve in determining of a wetland, but you can get a great grasp of it by reading section 404 of the clean air and water act of 1977. I used to work in the field, for the private land owners, and fight the state and the feds all day long. They will try and claim jurisdiction on anything they can.
 
#11 ·
I would listen to Standrew, that is pretty much verbatim of the ACOE wetland delination book. Any more detail and it may get a bit confusing. Nicely Done Standrew. and for the pitcher plants, from my understanding the are endangered. I don't know anywhere around here where they are plentiful, personally in 10 years I have only seen maybe 5 total. My question.. Why the intrest???

Robert
 
#6 ·
There are also a few online resources that can help. The USFWS National Wetland Inventory Mapper is great resource to help understand the area under consideration.

http://www.fws.gov/wetlands/Data/Mapper.html

If you are unsure then I would seek the advice of a professional. There are several consulting firms in the area that can help including my company Wetland Sciences, Inc.

Good luck and embrace the Lilies!

Keith Johnson
 
#20 ·
There are also a few online resources that can help. The USFWS National Wetland Inventory Mapper is great resource to help understand the area under consideration.

http://www.fws.gov/wetlands/Data/Mapper.html

If you are unsure then I would seek the advice of a professional. There are several consulting firms in the area that can help including my company Wetland Sciences, Inc.

Good luck and embrace the Lilies!

Keith Johnson
Thanks, Keith for the link. May need to give you a call. Gotta question.
 
#13 ·
I agree with Jim T. Wetlands are a good thing. Some bring in water fowl and they are a good for water drainage and clean up sink. I'm guessing that the reason for this post is because you are looking to buy property. Some of the areas over on Innerarity Point may have already done some mitigation if being sold by a developer. Before I bought, I would look into the history. You may have to do a lot more to the property then what you want to spend to make it in compliance.
 
#14 ·
Seek a professional. I had a lot on the intracoastal where I wanted to build a dock for a boat lift.

It was 380' or so to deeper water (5' or so depth) that went past the vital eel grass beds.

Because of the length of the pier I would be over the square footage for a lease fee. That is a fee to be paid if you exceed a square footage for a simple small pier. Just pulling numbers out of my butt... If you want a small pier say 1000 square feet you simply pay a one time fee. But if you want a 2000 sq feet pier you will pay a yearly fee.

My proposed pier would have had me pay a yearly lease. But because I agreed to extend it out past the grass bed they waived any yearly fees and granted a one time waiver.

You only know this via an Environmental expert.

Keith (Tcat) from a previous post on this board was my expert. He negotiated with the state and saved me money because I was willing to build a longer pier past the grass.

I think it was $800 or so, but that was a few years ago.

But the State will work with you if you are willing to "mitigate"

Jim
 
#16 · (Edited)
HisName, Those pictures show everything one needs to determine a wetland. Notice the buttressing of the trees? That is a mechanism of wetland trees to stand up in an unstable environment. That would be a function of hydrology. Just because the creek is the only part that holds water, there is a floodplain and/or a bog associated with it that constitutes a larger ecosystem. Most likely, those are black gum trees (Nyssa sp) and sweet bays. The soils in that area should be black and mucky. When walking out of that ecosystem, the veg and soils will change. When you start to see saw palmetto, gallberry, oaks, fetterbush, bracken fern etc...., you will be in the area of calling it an upland. Most of our area used to be wet prairie before sylviculture arrived. Delineating and reconstructing those areas gets fun.

@TCAT.... You hired me about a decade ago to do some mitigation planting for you for some small job. I ended up working in Panama City for about 6 years before getting out of the field and doing something else. Glad to see you're still kickin.

@rsekerka73.... I hate that friggin manual! We have a few different varieties of pitcher plants in the panhandle. Most are in wet prairies, ditches, edges of bogs, and sometimes scattered in planted slash pine. A good place to find them are powerline easements that cut through wetlands. Look on the slopes or edges. Mowing mimics fire and the PPs love it. Fire suppression is why some PP are endangered. They are everywhere though, and not all are endangered. Sarracenia flava is a very common one that I dont believe to be endangered. S purpurea, leukaphylla, and pstitticina are more rare. Those are probably spelled wrong.... Its been a while. There are some really cool seepage slopes @ UWF that are wetlands ecosystems starting at the tops of hills that have Pitcher plants.
 
#17 ·
Thanks for the Info standrew
I just leave the designated wetlands alone other than to hike and hunt.

My road over the creek was OK'ed and built with permit.
EPA said it was no problem building a platform over the creek because I didn't dig , or fill
I built it on a fallen tree that is still alive without any pylons.
 

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#18 · (Edited)
wetlands are a good thing until they are in your backyard and the government takes your property.

almost the whole state of florida was a wetland at one time.

wetlands are a perfect example of over regulation.

pitcher plants are everywhere most men dont tread.

mitigate means the government gets 13 acres and you get to fill 1 acre.

anyone can make a wetland determination, but it has to be approved by dep and the corp of engineers.

there are two good local companies that make determinations:
edmisten & associates 435-9367
wetland sciences 453-4700
 
#21 ·
I'm looking at but adjacent. Would be kind of cool to own though. May make the owner an offer since his cost to mitigate may be substantially more than it is worth.

Remember, you only have to mitigate if you dredge or fill a wetland. Ratios are determined on a mutually exclusive basis (for the most part). People have made lots of $ buying wetlands, restoring them, and selling mitigation/conservation areas to others developing within the same watershed.
 
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