feelin' wright

Artificial Reefs do increase the fish populations. In previous times 40,50 60s all commercial fisherman went to the bay of campeche to fish for red snapper. Now we are able to have commerical fisherman fish far closer to port resulting in the same catch weights. Can you explain this? Im sure you will say that the goverment is the only one that contribituted to this. Hows that kool aid

You say that artifical reefs do not increase the red snapper population that is total bullshit. Habitat is critical in maintaing a healthy fish population. Look at the jewfish in south florida. One of the main issue down south is the development of mangroves which destroys the habitat of the juvenile fish. Artificail reefs provide the same protective enviroment that the mangroves do in south florida. They allow the snapper to feed and to avoid other predatory fish. Since the fish are in a protected enviroment and have an abundance of prey the fish have a better shot to mature into the spawning population of red snapper. Less habitat= less fish it is that simple.

lbhuntley

Feelin' wright, I wish additional artificial reefs were the answer. But, I believe we are seeing a recovery of red snapper because of a dramatic decrease in bycatch (shrimping has declined by 75-80%) and a management plan that sets realistic annual catch limits based on best available science.

These solutions have been around for many years but they are finally in place.

Tom Hilton

LBHuntley,
Who do you work for - Environmental Defense or the NMFS? There's really not much difference between the 2, but was just wondering.

Since the recreational TAC was tied directly to the shrimper bycatch issue, the NMFS mandate an 84% reduction reduction in bycatch across the board. Thus, the recreational season went from 6 months, 4 fish limits to the current 54 day, 2 fish limits. The bycatch has been reduced by factors such as hurricanes, bad economy, and low imported shrimp prices - not anything done by the NMFS.

Additionally, the data used to mandate the reduction in bycatch severely underestimated natural mortality of said bycatch. In fact, propaganda from enviro.orgs and the CCA stated that shrimpers were responsible for killing 80% of every year class of snapper due to bycatch. Fact of the matter is that the 0-1 snapper have an extremely high nartural mortality rate (about 90%), so whether or not the snapper are killed in shrimp nets is a moot point - they are going to be eaten most likely anyways.

To claim that the snapper "recovery" is due to reduced shriomping effort is false. To claim that artificial reefs do not enhance snapper populations is equally false. To claim that the NMFS is regulating snapper with viable data is about as bogus as it gets.

Again, as I asked before - post up the link to the paper where Dr. Shipp concluded that reefs merely attracted snapper.

Tom Hilton

lbhuntley

Tom, #17 of this thread. Read the last two paragraphs just before the acknowledgments.

Tom Hilton

LBHuntley,
Who do you work for - Environmental Defense or the NMFS? You never answered.

The paper you referenced is almost 10 years old and headed by James Cowan of LSU, not Shipp.

Here is the latest paper by Shipp (2009) - it's too long to post up but here's the title and conclusion, which states; "...it will be necessary to maintain, or even increase the amount of artificial habitat in the northern Gulf of Mexico to keep pace with fishing pressure. Programs such as the “rigs to reefs” efforts off Louisiana and Texas would have to be continued, as would the reef construction off Alabama."




The massive additions of artificial reef habitat preferred by red snapper during the last fifty years in the northcentral and northwestern Gulf of Mexico has corresponded with major shifts in harvest locations and areas of red snapper concentrations. This suggests that habitat was a factor that limited population abundance during the first one hundred years of the fishery. Current model projections of MSY at levels higher than have ever been achieved also suggest that increases in habitat have increased harvest potential. However, because current models are premised on a stock of red snapper that is recruitment limited, these stocks are considered “overfished and overfishing is occurring”. Consideration of increased habitat would lead to a different conclusion (i.e., the stocks have an unrealized harvest potential).
In addition, if the habitat limitation hypothesis is correct, it will be necessary to maintain, or even increase the amount of artificial habitat in the northern Gulf of Mexico to keep pace with fishing pressure. Programs such as the “rigs to reefs” efforts off Louisiana and Texas would have to be continued, as would the reef construction off Alabama.

Polebender

Seems funny to me that the guy holding a commercial license doesn't see anything wrong with the way things are....can't blame him I guess, if the laws were stacked in my favor i wouldn't complain either...If I could bring back a boat load of fish that were caught over public ARTIFICIAL REEFS when ever I felt like it, I would argue that things are getting better too....Thanks Tom for presenting an educated, logical argument that things are messed up and standing up for the recreational guys.

aroundthehorn

Bump.