Plan to take 1/2 our TAC!

Candy · 11-18-2008, 06:55 PM

Attention All Recreational Fishermen and Businessesthat rely on Recreational Fishing to survive.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com

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>Belowis a proposal that will be presented to the FFWCC in <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com

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lace> December 3rd & 4th 2008 by a group of Charter Boat Owners. <o

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>The supporters of the "SOS Plan" (S[/B]ave O[/B]ur S[/B]elves) want to take 50% of the Recreational Total Allowable Catch and create a "For-Hire" sector similar to the Commercial Sector. I was told by a very reliable source that Roy Crabtree likes this idea and said as much at a meeting in Mobile a few weeks ago during an "Off-the-Record"meeting with several of the attendees.<o

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>What would this mean to Private Recreational Fishermen? It would mean that we would go from having 49% of the TAC (Total Allowable Catch) to having 24.5% of the TAC.<o

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>Basically, if adopted, 2 very small special interest groups (Commercial & For-Hire) would be GIVEN 75.5 percent of all the fish that are allowed to be caught in the <st1

lace w:st="on">Gulf of <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1

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>This would be devastating to not only the recreational fisherman but also to Boat Dealers, Boat Mechanics, Marina?s, Fishing & Tackle stores, Scuba shops that sell spearfishing gear, boat insurance sales, all the mechanics that service the millions of private boats and the list could go on and on! <st1

lace w:st="on"><st1:State w:st="on">Florida</st1:State></st1

lace>?s economy enjoys approximately $10,000 per minute from Recreational Saltwater Fishing. We must be proactive and save our rights to fish and our economy!<o

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>BTW, not all Charter Boat Owners support this plan! However, support is growing because many Charter Owners are hurtingand desperatedue to the restrictions placed on the Fishery by NMFS limiting the Federal Red Snapper Season.I have always supported the Charter Industry because they are professional transportation for Recreational Fishermen, however; I don't support this scheme to hijack 50% of the Recreational Total Allowable Catch. <o></o><o

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>The best plans are always WIN-WIN plans.<o

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>This plan is a big looser for Recreational Fishermen and the Businesses that rely on them!<o

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>If you would like to participate in writing a Win-Win plan, Please contact me with your ideas. candy@valp.net <o></o><o></o>Spread the word, the future of Recreational Fishing could be at stake!<o

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>Candy Hansard********************************************* ****SOS Plan (Save-Our-Selves)[/B]Exploring a New Direction to Improve For-Hire Red Snapper Fishing <o

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>[/B]What?s happening? ? [/B]The 2008 red snapper season was the shortest on record. This was due to the NMFS?s commitment to making sure that all sectors stay within their allotted allocation. Additionally, new government accountability measures will require that any future overages are compensated for, which could result in even shorter seasons in the future. The continued loss of fishing time and subsequent loss of business revenues highlights the desperate situation facing our industry. <o

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>It has become clear that we must reevaluate the position of the for-hire recreational fisheries sector. If negative trends continue, we stand to lose all the investment and years of labor we have collectively put into making our profession an industry. Something has to change.[/B] <o

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>Until this year, many of us thought that we could get by with shortened seasons and fewer fish. Some of our industry leaders have even suggested the solution is the status quo and have promoted the continuity of the relationship we have with the private recreational fishers. <o

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>This is no solution at all and the reason is simple: We are professional fishers who operate for-profit businesses. [/B]Both the National Research Council and the National Marine Fisheries Service agree on this point. [/B]Sure, [/B]we may all fall under the recreational sector allocation umbrella for fisheries management purposes, but we approach fishing from an entirely different perspective. Our opinion is simply that we can no longer afford to be attached to a recreational sector of unknown quantities, effort, landings and unregulated growth. <o

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>The time to become involved is now - [/I][/B]Several for-hire businessmen are exploring how to better serve our customers, count and conserve fish, and build equity in our businesses assets. We realize the consequences of inaction: longer fishery rebuilding, fewer fishing days, and lost economic potential for our businesses. Any profitable business must have stability so owners can plan for the future. It is imperative that we all take a leadership role in developing common-sense management options to obtain stability, sustainability and give us hope for a better future. The NMFS and the Gulf Council have both indicated that they are ready to roll up their sleeves and work for better management. We believe they will be receptive to an industry led effort to make positive change. <o

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>Getting started - [/B]To begin, we want to develop a set of goals to guide our discussions and the development of this proposal such as: · Provide a reliable platform for the public to access and enjoy sport fishing.· Improve service to customers with year-around access and the ability to custom-tailor trips.· Build stability and equity in for-hire businesses.· Achieve high accountability by counting all fish caught.· Rebuild and maintain a viable for-hire fishery.· Gain fair and equitable management.· Increase industry control over management.<o

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>Achieving our Goals - [/B]Changes in recreational management will require compromise by several parties, including our industry, and it will neither be easy nor pain- free, but it is an opportunity to put our industry back on track to recover what we have lost, rebuild our investment, and eventually recover equity in our fishery. There are a lot of steps to a new management program, including a proposal, Gulf Council plans, and implementation by NMFS. This is a daunting task, but the alternative ? the status quo - equates to nothing more than rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. Here is a summary of our proposal:<o

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>1. Secure our allocation. [/B]We would begin by obtaining a ?control date? from the NMFS which would freeze the current percentages of recreational sector allocation between the private recreational anglers and the For-Hire Sector based upon landings history. We don?t want anything more than our fair share: only that what we have historically caught. [/B]Then we would obtain an agreement from NMFS that the percentages will remain fixed for a minimum of two years to provide enough time to get the proper monitoring tools in place by NMFS and the industry.<o

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>2. Put monitoring tools in place.[/B] The next step is to decide what monitoring tools we want. For starters, we think just two: VMS and electronic logbooks. These tools will provide us the opportunity of real-time catch reporting and will determine, at a high level of accuracy, who is fishing and what they are catching.<o

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>3. Professionalize the industry: [/B]Monitoring tools such as VMS and electronic log books will give scientists and managers better data for management decisions and will give the industry accountability, so that when fish stocks rebound, the information can be trusted and catch levels can be increased. Increasing the fishermen?s role in data collection and management of the fishery will instill a positive stake in data collection and foster a proactive attitude and participation to further enhance fisheries management.<o

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>4. Create a Red Snapper Endorsement: As our new sector begins to collect accurate, real-time data through the implementation of VMS and electronic logbooks, a clear picture of who is dependent on red snapper for their livelihoods will immerge. This information can then be used to determine eligibility for any future management plan for the red snapper fishery. Fishermen who have implemented VMS and electronic logbooks and have snapper landings can then be given an endorsement for red snapper and will be eligible to participate in the fishery. Fairness is of utmost importance, whether you have been in business for6 months or 50 years, have a six-pack boat or a party boatall [/B]participants start on the same date with the same access dictated by the NMFS current opening and closings that we are fishing under now.<o

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>5. Support law enforcement. [/B]Throughout this process, we will support law enforcement, which will authenticate our honesty in record keeping. Through VMS, enforcement officers can easily contact vessels and verify catch, and catch composition, with random, unannounced inspections. We support strict penalties including disqualification for anyone caught cheating or ?cooking the books.? We also encourage the apprehension and prosecution of individuals illegally conducting a For-Hire business. <o

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>Hopefully, you?ll agree with us that failure to do nothing is certain failure. We welcome your participation in changing the current direction of our industry into a productive business where our sons and daughters have a future in the fishery.<o

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Voodoo Lounge · 11-18-2008, 10:08 PM

Lets see a list of those who support this idea!!! CAPT. and boat name would be nice

JoeZ · 11-18-2008, 10:11 PM

Working on a list for you Tony B, for some reason, nobody wants to put their name behind this genius plan.

Wonder why?

lbhuntley · 11-18-2008, 10:38 PM

Did anyone notice the recommendation includes looking at landing history for charter and recreational? Charter is not interested in taking anything from recreational. They simply want to manage their historical share and not be penalized if recreational overfishes. Full time charter captains make their living from fishing and must havea more predictable season. As I'vestated before:recreational, you have complained you have not caught your historical share. This may be an opportunity for you to manage your fishery. Neither commercialnor charterwill be able tocatch your fish! If youdon't catch as many fish because of reduced trips (weather/fuel costs) your season would be extended.JoeZ, how about explaining specifically why you are against this proposal.

Voodoo Lounge · 11-18-2008, 11:15 PM

opcorn Here we go!!

Candy · 11-19-2008, 04:12 AM

Capt Jarvis asked me to share his response so here it is:Ms Hansard, I appreciate you sharing our plan with a lot of the people that we do not have normal contact with. Unfortunately you may have some confusion concerning some of the most important aspects of this plan to help our industry survive in this newMSA reauthorization environment we must now operate in.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com

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> First of all we,the charter for hire sector whois now being managed as a separate sector are asking only for what we have historically caught over the last ten years since we became a limited entry group due to the federal permit process. According to MRFSS data since 1996 -2006 we have caught 61% of the recreational TAC ( total allowable catch) and the private rec sector has caught 39%. This catch data is what the NMFS has used in all its management decisions concerning the red snapper fishery including start and stop days and length of seasons .Also it has been used to determine daily fish and size limits. We are asking only for what we have been accredited as having caught No more, no less.We do not want one single pound from what the private recreational sector has caught according to the MRFSS data the last ten years.<o

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>We are not trying to steal a single pound of private recreationally caught fish. The catch limit for the private rec angler will stay at the same level that it has the last ten years percentage wise. Under this reduced TAC we fish under now it will affect the days to fish but the percentages remain the same.Our plan is only applying the historical catch history to our industry so we can manage the red snapper fishery in a manner that will help us to have a long term viable fishery. Our plan will not change one single aspect of what the private rec sector has doneover the last ten years . As a result it will not affect anyone who has a interest in sport fishing along the gulf coast in the private rec sector.The number one problem in most GOM fisheries including red snapper is the lack of accurate science and catch accountability.<o

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>As you can see by the tenets of this plan, that all our industry is asking to do is provide the managers of this resource the tools it need to stop over fishing and give them the science they need to make better decisions about how to manage red snapper. This plan will give them the ability to make better stock assessments and hopefully this will be the fastest way toset us back to higher TAC limits which not only benefit us but also the entire red snapper user groups including the private recreational sector.<o

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>Your historical catch history is safe under our plan. We do not want to infringe on what you deserve. However if you were to have a concern it should be that as of now your sector has no plan to address the up coming ACL's that start in 2009 and with over fishing and how that may affect your days to fish for red snapper. Under this new directive any amount of over fishing will be applied to the next year. In 2006 the MRFSS data showed a 566,620 lb overage that would be taken off the following year if the ACL was in place. We are presently fishing under a 1.49 million lb Tac, take 566,620 lbs from that and we would be fishing for only 823,380 the next years under ACL's.. In fact high overages have been recorded according to this data the last 4 or 5 years so most likely 2009-2010 we are going to lose a large amount though these overages and could face a total shut down of this fishery sooner rather than later.<o

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>Our plan with total catch accountability and real time data through VMS,and log books will protect us from these overages. We still wont get any more fish under the present TAC or with the reduced days of fishing but we will start to give the NMFS real science in a timely manner and we won't be penalized by ACL's.<o

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>On the math of the small user groups controlling 75% of the red snapper fishery. It would be better stated that 75% of the red snapper fishery would be totally accounted for with true catch history , true fishing effort and true science to help scientist to come up with better stock assessments and TAC limits. We who fish daily now know that red snapper fishing in the gulf is the best it has been in over 30 years but the poor science of the MRFSS system won't reflect that for months if not years. With real time data provided by our plan and the current commercial IFQ program for the first time in recent history we have a chance to actually manage a fishery with reality instead of pie in the sky speculation.<o

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>Last but not least please remember that although small in relative numbers the Charter For Hire industry per individual vessel bringsmillion of dollars to their local economy. We pay high dock rent at marinas , burn ten of thousand of gallons of fuel each season,I spend in excess of $15,000 dollars a year in tackle,we pay mechanics , boat insurance by the thousands and thereare over 1300 of us, The average out of state charter customer stays 2.5 days in our city and villages and spends thousand of dollars perone day charter on accommodations, restaurant, bars, shopping , Charter fees and tips. Not only that do notforget the fact that we are the only true public access for the average American citizen or foreign visitor to experience sport fishing in America. Our industry provide over 2 million anglers who have not the resources to purchase a boat and the expense that prevents most American citizens the ability to experiencefishing in the Gulf. The MRFSS dataof our historical catch history would suggest that we provide far more access to catchred snapper to theaverage salt water angler than a private recreational fisherman does.<o

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>So Ms Hansard I would like to hope you can see that we are not high jacking nothing from you or anyone else. we are not going to affect the recreational fisherman who wants to continue in the status quo fishing system in place now. In fact I suggest that he comes up with a accountability plan to get out of it ASAP. butif, in fact, our plan is implemented the future looks bright.That sooner ratherthan later that we can get higher TAC limits in a couple of years from now and when that happens, especially after the Recreational fisherman has been getting to fish for only a few days, thatour efforts will be appreciated when with a higher TAC his fishing days will be increased as well.<o

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>You have taken the time to alert those who you know based on your understanding of our plan. I have taken the time to try and clear up some of your concerns and I hope I have done that in a forth rite manner. I will answer any and all questions that you may have and will look forward to a response from you with any concerns you have about our efforts or any ideas that you may have that would help youto maybe change your position. I would however in the interest of fairness ask that you send my response to you to all that you contacted so maybe they can join in this debate . I think it would be helpful to all who fish for red snapper. Thank you for your time<o

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> Capt. Gary Jarvis<o

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>This was my response to Capt Jarvis:Capt. Jarvis,<o

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>Thank you for your thoughtful response.<o

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>I?m sure if I was going to present a plan to the FFWCC that would descriminate against the Charter Operators that you would pass it around to alert the troops. I am not your enemy, I have been fighting the same battle for better data and accountability in our fishery management. I have also worked very hard to educate private recreational fishermen that the Charter Guys are our alies. This plan threatens to shatter that alliance.You said you would answer questions so here are some that are on my mind right now:<o

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>1. How exactly is this plan going to help the small operator grow his business and compete with the fleet operators once the ?Historical Data? is established?<o

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>2. Why aren?t you going after the Commercial TAC if you are wanting to be viewed as a Commercial Sector?<o

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>3. Have you requested the MRFSS Data from the NMFS? (I?m not talking about their compilation report, I?m talking about the RAW data.)<o

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>I would like to come up with a plan that would benefit all Recreational Fishermen including Charter Operators. If you would like to be part of that dialog, you are very welcome to share ideas that would help to accomplish that goal. You may not get 100% unity with the Charter industry with this plan but I can pretty much guarantee that the Private Recreational Fishermen will be united 100% against it.<o

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>Candy Hansard<o

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FelixH · 11-19-2008, 08:23 AM

My biggest problem with this plan is this:

How many recreational fishers have EVER been asked "How many red snapper did you catch today (or this week, this month, this year)". The only time I've ever been asked was when the FWC was doing random checks for licenses and size/bag limits, which I'm fairly certain they don't record or report. Even if they did, they're still only talking to a relative few anglers.

How in the HELL can anyone say that we've caught X percentage of the TAC when there is absolutely NO data on the private boat recreational catch?

It would seem to me, before implementing any large changes in TAC allocation, there should be Reliable data collected from ALL sectors. They should find a way to make this happen before making rules based on numbers they are just pulling from their asses!

Candy · 11-19-2008, 10:31 AM

<HR style="COLOR: #d1d1e1; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #d1d1e1" SIZE=1> <DIV id=post_message_4087>Below are two questions every Recreational Fisherman should be asking:

1. Why should there even be sectors? Doesn't the Resource belong to ALL of us? If the resource belongs to ALL of us, then we are all shareholders. We are all shareholders, so why should a few people get the biggest share while we get thrown scraps without fair compensation?

2. If the Charter Industry unites to become a Commercial Sector, they should split up the Commercial TAC. Ooops, that won't work because the "Historical Catch" quota scheme has locked everyone that isn't already in, OUT. It has also locked the small commercial operators into their "small" status. The "Historical Catch" scheme, if embraced by the Recreational Charters, would do EXACTLY the same thing in the Charter Industry. The big Charter boys guarantee they will stay the big boys and they will NEVER have to worry about competition from you, the small Charter Businesses, because the Quota system will guarantee you will never be able to grow your business.

Charters are either Recreational or they are Commercial. Personally, I believe the Charter Industry will be better off in the Recreational sector but I'm not a Charter Owner so I can't speak for them.

I have always supported the Recreational Charter Industry and even gone to bat to help save them. I thought we were all in this together and we should all stick together. I'm sure there are many Charter Owners that agree with that sentiment. The SOS plan does NOT benefit the entire Charter industry equitably and should be rejected by the majority of Charter Owners because they will loose in the long run.

Any Charter Owner that is on the fence with this issue should remember the 2004 election and Pregnant Pigs. If voters would protect pregnant pigs, what makes you think they wouldn't protect the poor little mistreated private recreational fisherman? Let's see...we have 2.7 million licensed recreational fishermen in Florida and that doesn't include everyone over 65 that isn't required to buy a license...do you think we might have a ground swelling of support? I think even non-fishermen would see the injustice in the system and come to our rescue.

<DIV align=center>I will say it again, lets come up with a win-win plan for Recreational Fishermen, Private and Charter.
I will listen to any ideas that would help accomplish that goal.</DIV>

If you don't want to share your ideas publicly, send me a private e-mail. I'm listening to every idea that comes across my desk.
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need2fish · 11-19-2008, 12:24 PM

Seems like a competing plan that also promises better recreational sector data would be looked on favorably. Sounds like that is what has Crabtrees interest - the promise of more reliable/accurate data.

Ocean Man · 11-19-2008, 02:06 PM

This is one of my problems with it "We don?t want anything more than our fair share: only that what we have historically caught." Wouldn't we all love to be able to keep what we have historically caught and not the new reduced bag limits.

11-18-2008, 06:55 PM	#1
Candy Member Ruby Red Lip Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 52	Plan to take 1/2 our TAC! <P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 14pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana; mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">Attention All Recreational Fishermen and Businessesthat rely on Recreational Fishing to survive.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>[/B]<P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">Belowis a proposal that will be presented to the FFWCC in <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comffice:smarttags" /><st1lace w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on">Key West</st1:City></st1lace> December 3rd & 4th 2008 by a group of Charter Boat Owners. <o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">The supporters of the "SOS Plan" (<B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">S[/B]ave <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">O[/B]ur <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">S[/B]elves) want to take 50% of the Recreational Total Allowable Catch and create a "For-Hire" sector similar to the Commercial Sector. <P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">I was told by a very reliable source that Roy Crabtree likes this idea and said as much at a meeting in Mobile a few weeks ago during an "Off-the-Record"meeting with several of the attendees.<o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">What would this mean to Private Recreational Fishermen? It would mean that we would go from having 49% of the TAC (<SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Total <SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Allowable <SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Catch) to having 24.5% of the TAC.<o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">Basically, if adopted, 2 very small special interest groups (Commercial & For-Hire) would be GIVEN 75.5 percent of all the fish that are allowed to be caught in the <st1lace w:st="on">Gulf of <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1lace w:st="on">Mexico</st1lace></st1:country-region></st1lace>! <o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">This would be devastating to not only the recreational fisherman but also to Boat Dealers, Boat Mechanics, Marina?s, Fishing & Tackle stores, Scuba shops that sell spearfishing gear, boat insurance sales, all the mechanics that service the millions of private boats and the list could go on and on! <st1lace w:st="on"><st1:State w:st="on">Florida</st1:State></st1lace>?s economy enjoys approximately $10,000 per minute from Recreational Saltwater Fishing. We must be proactive and save our rights to fish and our economy!<o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">BTW, not all Charter Boat Owners support this plan! <SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">However, support is growing because many Charter Owners are hurtingand desperatedue to the restrictions placed on the Fishery by NMFS limiting the Federal Red Snapper Season.<P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">I have always supported the Charter Industry because they are professional transportation for Recreational Fishermen, however; <U>I don't support this scheme to hijack 50% of the Recreational Total Allowable Catch. <o></o></U><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white" align=center><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 20pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">The best plans are always WIN-WIN plans.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 20pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 20pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">This plan is a big looser for Recreational Fishermen and the Businesses that rely on them!<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white" align=center><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 13.5pt; COLOR: red; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">If you would like to participate in writing a Win-Win plan, Please contact me with your ideas. candy@valp.net <o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 13.5pt; COLOR: red; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: white; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 13.5pt; COLOR: red; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">Spread the word, the future of Recreational Fishing could be at stake!<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f5080; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o></o><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 22pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Script MT Bold'; mso-no-proof: yes">Candy Hansard<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 22pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Script MT Bold'; mso-no-proof: yes">******************************************* <P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 22pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Script MT Bold'; mso-no-proof: yes"><P class=MsoNormal align=center><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 22pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Script MT Bold'; mso-no-proof: yes"><U>SOS Plan (Save-Our-Selves)</U><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 22pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Script MT Bold'; mso-no-proof: yes"><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">[/B]<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 22pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Script MT Bold'; mso-no-proof: yes"><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">Exploring a New Direction to Improve For-Hire Red Snapper Fishing <o></o>[/B]<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"><o></o>[/B]<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"><U>What?s happening</U>? ? [/B]The 2008 red snapper season was the shortest on record. This was due to the NMFS?s commitment to making sure that all sectors stay within their allotted allocation<SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">. Additionally, new government accountability measures will require that any future overages are compensated for, which could result in even shorter seasons in the future. The continued loss of fishing time and subsequent loss of business revenues highlights the desperate situation facing our industry. <o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">It has become clear that we must reevaluate the position of the for-hire recreational fisheries sector. If negative trends continue, we stand to lose all the investment and years of labor we have collectively put into making our profession an industry. <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">Something has to change.[/B] <o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">Until this year, many of us thought that we could get by with shortened seasons and fewer fish. Some of our industry leaders have even suggested the solution is the status quo and have promoted the continuity of the relationship we have with the private recreational fishers. <o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">This is no solution at all and the reason is simple: <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">We are professional fishers who operate for-profit businesses. [/B]Both the National Research Council and the National Marine Fisheries Service agree on this point.<B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"> [/B]Sure,<B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"> [/B]we may all fall under the recreational sector allocation umbrella for fisheries management purposes, but we approach fishing from an entirely different perspective. <SPAN style="COLOR: black; mso-bidi-font-family: Arial">Our opinion is simply that we can no longer afford to be attached to a recreational sector of unknown quantities, effort, landings and unregulated growth.<SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'"> <o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">The time to become involved is <I style="mso-bidi-font-style: normal">now - [/I][/B]Several for-hire businessmen are exploring how to better serve our customers, count and conserve fish, and build equity in our businesses assets. We realize the consequences of inaction: longer fishery rebuilding, fewer fishing days, and lost economic potential for our businesses. Any profitable business must have stability so owners can plan for the future. It is imperative that we all take a leadership role in developing common-sense management options to obtain stability, sustainability and give us hope for a better future. The NMFS and the Gulf Council have both indicated that they are ready to roll up their sleeves and work for better management. We believe they will be receptive to an industry led effort to make positive change. <SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"><U>Getting started - </U>[/B]To begin, we want to develop a set of goals to guide our discussions and the development of this proposal such as: <P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.25in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Symbol; mso-fareast-font-family: Symbol; mso-bidi-font-family: Symbol"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">·<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> Provide a reliable platform for the public to access and enjoy sport fishing.<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.25in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Symbol; mso-fareast-font-family: Symbol; mso-bidi-font-family: Symbol"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">·<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> Improve service to customers with year-around access and the ability to custom-tailor trips.<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.25in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Symbol; mso-fareast-font-family: Symbol; mso-bidi-font-family: Symbol"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">·<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> Build stability and equity in for-hire businesses.<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.25in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Symbol; mso-fareast-font-family: Symbol; mso-bidi-font-family: Symbol"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">·<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> Achieve high accountability by counting all fish caught.<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.25in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Symbol; mso-fareast-font-family: Symbol; mso-bidi-font-family: Symbol"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">·<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> Rebuild and maintain a viable for-hire fishery.<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.25in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Symbol; mso-fareast-font-family: Symbol; mso-bidi-font-family: Symbol"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">·<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> Gain fair and equitable management.<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.25in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1"><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: Symbol; mso-fareast-font-family: Symbol; mso-bidi-font-family: Symbol"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">·<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> Increase industry control over management.<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><U><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">A<B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">chieving our Goals - [/B]</U><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">Changes in recreational management will require compromise by several parties, including our industry, and it will neither be easy nor pain- free, but it is an opportunity to put our industry back on track to recover what we have lost, rebuild our investment, and eventually recover equity in our fishery. There are a lot of steps to a new management program, including a proposal, Gulf Council plans, and implementation by NMFS. This is a daunting task, but the alternative ? the status quo - equates to nothing more than rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. <P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">Here is a summary of our proposal:<o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">1. <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">Secure our allocation. [/B]We would begin by obtaining a ?control date? from the NMFS which would freeze the current percentages of recreational sector allocation between the private recreational anglers and the For-Hire Sector based upon landings history. We don?t want anything more than our fair share: only that what we have historically caught.<B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"> [/B]Then we would obtain an agreement from NMFS that the percentages will remain fixed for a minimum of two years to provide enough time to get the proper monitoring tools in place by NMFS and the industry.<o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">2. <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">Put monitoring tools in place.[/B] The next step is to decide what monitoring tools we want. For starters, we think just two: VMS and electronic logbooks. These tools will provide us the opportunity of real-time catch reporting and will determine, at a high level of accuracy, who is fishing and what they are catching.<o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><SPAN style="COLOR: black; mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">3. <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">Professionalize the industry: [/B]Monitoring tools such as VMS and electronic log books will give scientists and managers better data for management decisions and will give the industry accountability, so that when fish stocks rebound, the information can be trusted and catch levels can be increased. Increasing the fishermen?s role in data collection and management of the fishery will instill a positive stake in data collection and foster a proactive attitude and participation to further enhance fisheries management.<o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN style="COLOR: black; mso-bidi-font-family: Arial">4. Create a Red Snapper Endorsement:** <SPAN style="COLOR: black; mso-bidi-font-family: Arial; mso-bidi-font-weight: bold">As our new sector begins to collect accurate, real-time data through the implementation of VMS and electronic logbooks, a clear picture of who is dependent on red snapper for their livelihoods will immerge. This information can then be used to determine eligibility for any future management plan for the red snapper fishery. Fishermen who have implemented VMS and electronic logbooks and have snapper landings can then be given an endorsement for red snapper and will be eligible to participate in the fishery. F<SPAN style="COLOR: black; mso-bidi-font-family: Arial">airness is of utmost importance, whether you have been in business for6 months or 50 years, have a six-pack boat or a party boat<B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">all<SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-weight: bold"> [/B]participants start on the same date with the same access dictated by the NMFS current opening and closings that we are fishing under now.<o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; mso-bidi-font-family: Arial"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">5. <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">Support law enforcement. [/B]Throughout this process, we will support law enforcement, which will authenticate our honesty in record keeping. Through VMS, enforcement officers can easily contact vessels and verify catch, and catch composition, with random, unannounced inspections. We support strict penalties including disqualification for anyone caught cheating or ?cooking the books.? We also encourage the apprehension and prosecution of individuals illegally conducting a For-Hire business. <o></o><P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 6pt"><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: 'Courier New'">Hopefully, you?ll agree with us that failure to do nothing is certain failure. We welcome your participation in changing the current direction of our industry into a productive business where our sons and daughters have a future in the fishery.<o></o><P class=MsoNormal><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 22pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Script MT Bold'; mso-no-proof: yes"><o></o>

11-18-2008, 10:08 PM	#2
Voodoo Lounge Senior Member Sailfish Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 1,210	RE: Plan to take 1/2 our TAC! Lets see a list of those who support this idea!!! CAPT. and boat name would be nice

11-18-2008, 10:11 PM	#3
JoeZ I eat Blue Marlin Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Gulf Breezin' it Posts: 4,227	RE: Plan to take 1/2 our TAC! Working on a list for you Tony B, for some reason, nobody wants to put their name behind this genius plan. Wonder why?

11-18-2008, 10:38 PM	#4
lbhuntley Senior Member Mingo Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 155	RE: Plan to take 1/2 our TAC! Did anyone notice the recommendation includes looking at landing history for charter and recreational? Charter is not interested in taking anything from recreational. They simply want to manage their historical share and not be penalized if recreational overfishes. Full time charter captains make their living from fishing and must havea more predictable season. As I'vestated before:recreational, you have complained you have not caught your historical share. This may be an opportunity for you to manage your fishery. Neither commercialnor charterwill be able tocatch your fish! If youdon't catch as many fish because of reduced trips (weather/fuel costs) your season would be extended.JoeZ, how about explaining specifically why you are against this proposal.

11-18-2008, 11:15 PM	#5
Voodoo Lounge Senior Member Sailfish Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 1,210	RE: Plan to take 1/2 our TAC! opcorn Here we go!!

11-19-2008, 04:12 AM	#6
Candy Member Ruby Red Lip Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 52	RE: Plan to take 1/2 our TAC! <U>Capt Jarvis asked me to share his response so here it is:</U><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Ms Hansard, I appreciate you sharing our plan with a lot of the people that we do not have normal contact with. Unfortunately you may have some confusion concerning some of the most important aspects of this plan to help our industry survive in this newMSA <SPAN class=GramE>reauthorization environment we must now operate in.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> First of all we,the charter for hire sector whois now being managed as a separate sector are asking only for what we have historically caught over the last ten years since we became a limited entry group due to the federal permit process. According to MRFSS data since 1996 -2006 we have caught 61% of the recreational TAC <SPAN class=GramE>( total allowable catch) and the private rec sector has caught 39%. This catch data is what the NMFS has used in all its management decisions concerning the red snapper fishery including start and stop days and length of seasons .Also it has been used to determine daily<SPAN class=GramE> fish and size limits. We are asking only for what we have been accredited as having caught<SPAN class=GramE> <SPAN style="COLOR: red; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">No<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: red; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> more, no less<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">.We do not want one single pound from what the private recreational sector has caught according to the MRFSS data the last ten years.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">We are not trying to steal a single pound of private recreationally caught fish. The catch limit for the private rec angler will stay at the same level that it has the last ten years percentage wise. Under this reduced TAC we fish under now it will affect the days to fish but the percentages remain the same.Our plan is only applying the historical catch history to our industry so we can manage the red snapper fishery in a manner that will help us to have a long term viable fishery. Our plan will not change one single aspect of what the private rec sector has doneover the <SPAN class=GramE>last ten years . As a result it will not affect anyone who has <SPAN class=GramE>a interest in sport fishing along the gulf coast in the private rec sector.The number one problem in most GOM fisheries including red snapper is the lack of accurate science and catch accountability.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">As you can see by the tenets of this plan, that all our industry is asking to do is provide the managers of this resource the tools it need to stop over fishing and give them the science they need to make better decisions about how to manage red snapper. This plan will give them the ability to make better stock assessments and hopefully this will be the fastest way toset us back to higher TAC limits which not only benefit us but also the entire red snapper user groups including the private recreational sector.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Your historical catch history is safe under our plan. We do not want to infringe on what you deserve. However if you were to have a concern it should be that as of now your sector has no plan to address the up coming ACL's that start in 2009 and with over fishing and how that may affect your days to fish for red snapper. Under this new directive any amount of over fishing will be applied to the next year. In 2006 the MRFSS data showed a 566,620 lb overage that <SPAN class=GramE>would be taken off the following year if the ACL was in place. We are presently fishing under a 1.49 million lb <SPAN class=GramE>Tac, take 566,620 lbs from that and we would be fishing for only 823,380 the next years under ACL's.. In fact high overages have been recorded according to this data the last 4 or 5 years so most likely 2009-2010 we are going to lose a large amount though these overages and could face a total shut down of this fishery sooner rather than later.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Our plan with total catch accountability and real time data through VMS<SPAN class=GramE>,and log books will protect us from these overages. We still wont get any more fish under the present TAC or with the reduced days of fishing but we will start to give the NMFS real science in a timely manner and <SPAN class=GramE>we won't be penalized by ACL's.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=GramE><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">On the math of the small user groups controlling 75% of the red snapper fishery.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> It would be better stated that 75% of the red snapper fishery would be totally accounted for with true catch <SPAN class=GramE>history , true fishing effort and true science to help scientist to come up with better stock assessments and TAC limits. We who fish daily now know that red snapper fishing in the gulf is the best it has been in over 30 years but the poor science of the MRFSS system won't reflect that for months if not years. With real time data provided by our plan and the current commercial IFQ program for the first time in recent history we have a chance to actually manage a fishery with reality instead of pie in the sky speculation.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Last but not least please remember that although small in <SPAN class=GramE>relative numbers the Charter For Hire industry per individual vessel bringsmillion of dollars to their local economy. We pay high dock rent at <SPAN class=GramE>marinas , burn ten of thousand of gallons of fuel each season,I spend in excess of $15,000 dollars a year in tackle,we pay mechanics , boat insurance by the thousands and thereare over 1300 of us, The average out of state charter customer stays 2.5 days in our city and villages and spends thousand of dollars perone day charter on accommodations, restaurant, bars, shopping , Charter fees and tips. Not only that do notforget the fact that we are the only true public access for the average American citizen or foreign visitor to experience sport fishing in America. Our industry provide over 2 million anglers who have not the resources to purchase a boat and the expense that prevents most American citizens the ability to experiencefishing in the Gulf. The MRFSS dataof our historical catch history would suggest that we provide far more access to catchred snapper to theaverage salt water angler than a private recreational fisherman does.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">So Ms Hansard I would like to hope you can see that we are not high jacking <SPAN class=GramE>nothing from you or anyone else. <SPAN class=GramE>we are not going to affect the recreational fisherman who wants to continue in the status quo fishing system in place now. In fact I suggest that he comes up with <SPAN class=GramE>a accountability plan to get out of it ASAP. <SPAN class=GramE>butif, in fact, our plan is implemented the future looks bright.That sooner ratherthan later that we can get higher TAC limits in a couple of years from now and when that happens, especially after the Recreational fisherman has been getting to fish for only a few days, thatour efforts will be appreciated when with a higher TAC his fishing days will be increased as well.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">You have taken the time to alert those who you know based on your understanding of our plan. I have taken the time to try and clear up some of your concerns and I hope I have done that in a forth rite manner. I will answer any and all questions that you may have and will look forward to a response from you with any concerns you have about our efforts or any ideas that you may have that would help youto maybe change your position. I would however in the interest of fairness ask that you send my response to you to all that you contacted so maybe they can join in this <SPAN class=GramE>debate . I think it would be helpful to all who fish for red snapper. Thank you for your time<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Capt. Gary Jarvis<o></o><P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> F/V Back Down 2<o></o><P class=MsoAutoSig><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes"><U>This was my response to Capt Jarvis:</U><P class=MsoAutoSig><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes">Capt. Jarvis,<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes"><o></o><P class=MsoAutoSig><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes">Thank you for your thoughtful response.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes"><o></o><P class=MsoAutoSig><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes">I?m sure if I was going to present a plan to the FFWCC that would descriminate against the Charter Operators that you would pass it around to alert the troops. I am not your enemy, I have been fighting the same battle for better data and accountability in our fishery management. I have also worked very hard to educate private recreational fishermen that the Charter Guys are our alies. This plan threatens to shatter that alliance.<P class=MsoAutoSig><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes">You said you would answer questions so here are some that are on my mind right now:<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes"><o></o><P class=MsoAutoSig style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l1 level1 lfo2; tab-stops: list .5in"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">1.<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> <SPAN style="mso-no-proof: yes">How exactly is this plan going to help the small operator grow his business and compete with the fleet operators once the ?Historical Data? is established?<o></o><P class=MsoAutoSig style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l1 level1 lfo2; tab-stops: list .5in"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">2.<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> <SPAN style="mso-no-proof: yes">Why aren?t you going after the Commercial TAC if you are wanting to be viewed as a Commercial Sector?<o></o><P class=MsoAutoSig style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; mso-list: l1 level1 lfo2; tab-stops: list .5in"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">3.<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> <SPAN style="mso-no-proof: yes">Have you requested the MRFSS Data from the NMFS? (I?m not talking about their compilation report, I?m talking about the RAW data.)<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt; mso-no-proof: yes"><o></o><P class=MsoAutoSig><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes">I would like to come up with a plan that would benefit all Recreational Fishermen including Charter Operators. If you would like to be part of that dialog, you are very welcome to share ideas that would help to accomplish that goal. You may not get 100% unity with the Charter industry with this plan but I can pretty much guarantee that the Private Recreational Fishermen will be united 100% against it.<SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt; mso-no-proof: yes"><o></o><P class=MsoAutoSig><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 22pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Script MT Bold'; mso-no-proof: yes">Candy Hansard<o></o>

11-19-2008, 08:23 AM	#7
FelixH Senior Member Grouper Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Pensacola Posts: 1,076	RE: Plan to take 1/2 our TAC! My biggest problem with this plan is this: How many recreational fishers have EVER been asked "How many red snapper did you catch today (or this week, this month, this year)". The only time I've ever been asked was when the FWC was doing random checks for licenses and size/bag limits, which I'm fairly certain they don't record or report. Even if they did, they're still only talking to a relative few anglers. How in the HELL can anyone say that we've caught X percentage of the TAC when there is absolutely NO data on the private boat recreational catch? It would seem to me, before implementing any large changes in TAC allocation, there should be Reliable data collected from ALL sectors. They should find a way to make this happen before making rules based on numbers they are just pulling from their asses!

11-19-2008, 10:31 AM	#8
Candy Member Ruby Red Lip Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 52	RE: Plan to take 1/2 our TAC! <HR style="COLOR: #d1d1e1; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #d1d1e1" SIZE=1> <DIV id=post_message_4087>Below are two questions every Recreational Fisherman should be asking: 1. Why should there even be sectors? Doesn't the Resource belong to ALL of us? If the resource belongs to ALL of us, then we are all shareholders. We are all shareholders, so why should a few people get the biggest share while we get thrown scraps without fair compensation? 2. If the Charter Industry unites to become a Commercial Sector, they should split up the Commercial TAC. Ooops, that won't work because the "Historical Catch" quota scheme has locked everyone that isn't already in, OUT. It has also locked the small commercial operators into their "small" status. The "Historical Catch" scheme, if embraced by the Recreational Charters, would do EXACTLY the same thing in the Charter Industry. The big Charter boys guarantee they will stay the big boys and they will NEVER have to worry about competition from you, the small Charter Businesses, because the Quota system will guarantee you will never be able to grow your business. Charters are either Recreational or they are Commercial. Personally, I believe the Charter Industry will be better off in the Recreational sector but I'm not a Charter Owner so I can't speak for them. I have always supported the Recreational Charter Industry and even gone to bat to help save them. I thought we were all in this together and we should all stick together. I'm sure there are many Charter Owners that agree with that sentiment. The SOS plan does NOT benefit the entire Charter industry equitably and should be rejected by the majority of Charter Owners because they will loose in the long run. Any Charter Owner that is on the fence with this issue should remember the 2004 election and Pregnant Pigs. If voters would protect pregnant pigs, what makes you think they wouldn't protect the poor little mistreated private recreational fisherman? Let's see...we have 2.7 million licensed recreational fishermen in Florida and that doesn't include everyone over 65 that isn't required to buy a license...do you think we might have a ground swelling of support? I think even non-fishermen would see the injustice in the system and come to our rescue. <DIV align=center>I will say it again, lets come up with a win-win plan for Recreational Fishermen, Private and Charter. I will listen to any ideas that would help accomplish that goal.</DIV> If you don't want to share your ideas publicly, send me a private e-mail. I'm listening to every idea that comes across my desk. </DIV>

11-19-2008, 12:24 PM	#9
need2fish Senior Member Sailfish Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Navarre Posts: 1,493	RE: Plan to take 1/2 our TAC! Seems like a competing plan that also promises better recreational sector data would be looked on favorably. Sounds like that is what has Crabtrees interest - the promise of more reliable/accurate data.

11-19-2008, 02:06 PM	#10
Ocean Man Senior Member Sailfish Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bagdad, FL Posts: 1,484	RE: Plan to take 1/2 our TAC! This is one of my problems with it "We don?t want anything more than our fair share: only that what we have historically caught." Wouldn't we all love to be able to keep what we have historically caught and not the new reduced bag limits.

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