Land of the Free??

Matt Mcleod · 03-20-2010, 07:49 PM

I recently had a run in with a park ranger at Fort Pickens. He was upset about the location of my boat and so I tried to have a conversation with him about it since the FWC had given me different information. As I began the conversation to get a better understanding of the situation, he started screaming at me and said something I will never forget as long as I live. He said, ?I am a man in uniform and the authority out here, and you will do anything I tell you to or else!? The man?s name is Larry Edwards and to say he has an authority complex is an understatement.However, I thought about the bigger picture here, our access to the national park. I, like a lot of people, believed that we have better access to our local natural resources because of the national parks that we have in our area. I always thought we were lucky to have the parks around. I always thought the parks were for EVERYONES enjoyment, something we ALL have the right to use. I remember reading on the forum about problems at the park when it first reopened this year. I read about park rangers harassing patrons of the park and treating people like criminals for being out there. So my question is are we better off since we have national parks here? And what rights do we have to these public parks? Since I fish a lot and this is a fishing forum my research is pretty much limited to fishing and boat access to the park. I did some research and was shocked at just a few things I found!

This is a picture showing what waters[/B] in Pensacola Bay and the Gulf of Mexico are owned (yes owned!) by the federal government as the Fort Pickens National Park. There are laws that pertain to these waters that I did not know about. A list of things I did not know about the water owned by the national park:1. [/B]No flounder gigging allowed. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com

ffice

ffice" /><o

></o

>[/B]Every time we have flounder gigged down the Pickens beached we have broken a federal law!Spears and Gigs Closure (See also section Sec. 2.3, Fishing)Section 1.5 - 18 The following areas are closed to the use and possession of spears, gigs, spear guns, Hawaiian slings, and other similar devices, except that such devices may be on board vessels when stowed away and not available for immediate use. (a) In the Ft. Pickens area, the shore and waters adjacent to the Pensacola Bay shoreline between the Quartermaster dock location and a point 100 yards west of the rock jetties. 2.[/B] You cannot catch bait in these waters and leave with it to fish somewhere else, or take it home with you.<o

></o

>[/B] [/B]Ever caught sand fleas on the beach while pompano fishing and brought the extras home to freeze? Ever caught some mullet in the cast net or cigs with a sabiki and went somewhere else to fish with them? Surprise! You broke a federal law.

 Taking of Bait Closure

Section 1.5 - 20 The taking of bait from salt water bays, sounds, ponds and lagoons shall be limited to the amount for immediate on-site personal use only.

3 It is illegal to chum with pieces of fish with in 500 ft of the Fort Pickens pier.<o

></o

>[/B]4. No commercial fishing in these waters. That?s what fouled up the bait man last year; he can?t come within a mile of the beach.<o

></o

>[/B]These are just a few things I came up with in a short search! I?m scared to look any further! This is the part that is the scariest. The National Park statutes allow the superintendent of the park to decide what areas will be open to fishing, and even give him or her the power to end all fishing activities in the park?s waters. So it is possible and within the law to prohibit all fishing and boat access in the shaded areas on the map above.[/I] The superintendent?s name is Nina A. Kelson. <o

></o

>[/B]

I guess my point is this: I?m tired of the government thinking they know what?s best for me!

It used to be WE ALL owned and had a right to things like our national parks. That these parks were created for US! For mine and your benefit! For us all to have access to our natural resources!

Not the case! Have no doubt the government owns this property! Just ask Larry Edwards, if he doesn?t like what you?re doing then LOOK OUT! So, I refer back to the title of this thread. Land of the free? Think so?[/B] Then take your family out to the park by boat. Park it within 200? of the old pier. Build a camp fire on the beach using driftwood you found at or below the mean high tide line. Dig a few sand fleas and use them to catch a pompano which you clean and throw the carcass in the water. Put a dozen sand fleas in the boat to take home to use on your next trip. Look around a little for a flounder to gig after dark. Then fall asleep by the fire on the beach.You just committed 7 federal crimes! You should be ashamed!

Snagged Line · 03-20-2010, 08:06 PM

Sounds like you have CRIMINAL TENDENCIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (damn i wish i could spell)

Thanks for the information posted, I "may" have commitied a crime or two myself............maybe your new friend was picked on for being a nerd in his youth???????

Kim · 03-20-2010, 08:30 PM

Sorry you had a bad experience. Just take the high road in life and treat them as you want to be treated, maybe it will rub off on them and they may be nicer to the next guy. Like the old saying goes a few rotten apples in the barrel. Don't let one person who doesn't treat you with the respect you deserve while enjoying our national resources spoil it for you. Best thing to do is file a complaint about the person's treatment of you, especially since you know the individuals name. FWC has a site of their own for this be it a good or bad input, I'm sure the national parks service has the same thing.

Telum Pisces · 03-20-2010, 08:41 PM

Pickens has went to the birds. Literally. I think 4 years without people having access has got the rangers worked up that they now need to deal with people. That place used to be a place to go relax and enjoy. Now you have to worry about every tiny little rule out there or they will fine you. And they will be rude about it a lot of times if you even ask why.

It is no longer a place to enjoy like we did in the older days. The rangers out there have gone nuts. It's like they do not want people to be out there and to enjoy everything that the park has to offer. They are too worried about camper tires being 100% on the asphault parking spots etc... and other stupid crap.

choppedliver · 03-20-2010, 08:51 PM

Amazing.

One more thing to get me riled up about our government. I swear it's going to come down to a revolt by the people in my lifetime. Government is out of hand. Gradualism has taken it's toll.

Marine Scout · 03-20-2010, 08:53 PM

Sorry you had this problem, but great info!!

Jason · 03-20-2010, 09:55 PM

There are some screwey rules out there....Now the fires, I understand, since we have the whitest beaches, it would be nice to keep it that way...but there are some strange 1's out there....:banghead

frydaddy · 03-20-2010, 10:32 PM

pray for another hurricane

mdrobe2 · 03-20-2010, 11:01 PM

The rangers at Ft Pickens have harassed me from time to time and I never saw what public interest they were serving. It's a shame we have folks out there earning a living off our taxes that are such a pain. Not saying they all are, just saying Matt and I both had a bad time.

billfishguy17 · 03-20-2010, 11:18 PM

What yall need to do is get the name of the officers and write both of your US Senators and tell them how the public is bing treated. When the NPS get that from the US Senators they will start being courteous. But it's not until it rolls down from the top do they start to respect people. These beauracrats need to realize who is paying their salary.

03-20-2010, 07:49 PM	#1
Matt Mcleod Senior Member Grouper Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 933	Land of the Free?? I recently had a run in with a park ranger at Fort Pickens. He was upset about the location of my boat and so I tried to have a conversation with him about it since the FWC had given me different information. As I began the conversation to get a better understanding of the situation, he started screaming at me and said something I will never forget as long as I live. He said, ?I am a man in uniform and the authority out here, and you will do anything I tell you to or else!? The man?s name is Larry Edwards and to say he has an authority complex is an understatement.However, I thought about the bigger picture here, our access to the national park. I, like a lot of people, believed that we have better access to our local natural resources because of the national parks that we have in our area. I always thought we were lucky to have the parks around. I always thought the parks were for EVERYONES enjoyment, something we ALL have the right to use. I remember reading on the forum about problems at the park when it first reopened this year. I read about park rangers harassing patrons of the park and treating people like criminals for being out there. So my question is are we better off since we have national parks here? And what rights do we have to these public parks? Since I fish a lot and this is a fishing forum my research is pretty much limited to fishing and boat access to the park. I did some research and was shocked at just a few things I found!This is a picture showing what <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">waters[/B] in Pensacola Bay and the Gulf of Mexico are owned (yes owned!) by the federal government as the Fort Pickens National Park. There are laws that pertain to these waters that I did not know about. A list of things I did not know about the water owned by the national park:<P style="TEXT-INDENT: -0.25in; MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt 0.5in; mso-list: l0 level1 lfo1" class=MsoListParagraphCxSpFirst><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-family: Calibri; mso-bidi-theme-font: minor-latin"><SPAN style="mso-list: Ignore">1.<SPAN style="FONT: 7pt 'Times New Roman'"> [/B]<B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">No flounder gigging allowed. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>[/B]<P style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt 0.5in" class=MsoListParagraphCxSpLast>Every time we have flounder gigged down the Pickens beached we have broken a federal law!<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-weight: bold">Spears and Gigs Closure (See also section Sec. 2.3, Fishing)<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in">Section 1.5 - 18 The following areas are closed to the use and possession of spears, gigs, spear guns, Hawaiian slings, and other similar devices, except that such devices may be on board vessels when stowed away and not available for immediate use. <P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in">(a) In the Ft. Pickens area, the shore and waters adjacent to the Pensacola Bay shoreline between the Quartermaster dock location and a point 100 yards west of the rock jetties. <P style="TEXT-INDENT: -0.5in; MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">2.[/B]<SPAN style="mso-tab-count: 1"> <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">You cannot catch bait in these waters and leave with it to fish somewhere else, or take it home with you.<o></o>[/B]<P style="TEXT-INDENT: -0.5in; MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal"><SPAN style="mso-tab-count: 1"> [/B]Ever caught sand fleas on the beach while pompano fishing and brought the extras home to freeze? Ever caught some mullet in the cast net or cigs with a sabiki and went somewhere else to fish with them? Surprise! You broke a federal law. <SPAN style="mso-tab-count: 1"> <SPAN style="mso-bidi-font-weight: bold">Taking of Bait Closure Section 1.5 - 20 The taking of bait from salt water bays, sounds, ponds and lagoons shall be limited to the amount for immediate on-site personal use only. <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">3 <SPAN style="mso-tab-count: 1"> It is illegal to chum with pieces of fish with in 500 ft of the Fort Pickens pier.<o></o>[/B]<P style="TEXT-INDENT: -0.5in; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">4.<SPAN style="mso-tab-count: 1"> No commercial fishing in these waters. That?s what fouled up the bait man last year; he can?t come within a mile of the beach.<o></o>[/B]<P style="MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in">These are just a few things I came up with in a short search! I?m scared to look any further!<P style="TEXT-INDENT: -0.5in; MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><SPAN style="mso-tab-count: 1"> <B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">This is the part that is the scariest. The National Park statutes allow the superintendent of the park to decide what areas will be open to fishing, and even give him or her the power to end all fishing activities in the park?s waters. <I style="mso-bidi-font-style: normal">So it is possible and within the law to prohibit all fishing and boat access in the shaded areas on the map above.[/I] The superintendent?s name is Nina A. Kelson. <o></o>[/B] I guess my point is this: I?m tired of the government thinking they know what?s best for me! It used to be WE ALL owned and had a right to things like our national parks. That these parks were created for US! For mine and your benefit! For us all to have access to our natural resources! Not the case! Have no doubt the government owns this property! Just ask Larry Edwards, if he doesn?t like what you?re doing then LOOK OUT! <P style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt 0.5in" class=MsoNormal><B style="mso-bidi-font-weight: normal">So, I refer back to the title of this thread. Land of the free? Think so?[/B] Then take your family out to the park by boat. Park it within 200? of the old pier. Build a camp fire on the beach using driftwood you found at or below the mean high tide line. Dig a few sand fleas and use them to catch a pompano which you clean and throw the carcass in the water. Put a dozen sand fleas in the boat to take home to use on your next trip. Look around a little for a flounder to gig after dark. Then fall asleep by the fire on the beach.<P style="TEXT-INDENT: -0.5in; MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt 0.5in" class=MsoNormal>You just committed 7 federal crimes! You should be ashamed! __________________ Captain Matt Mcleod www.hotspotscharters.com www.hotspotstackle.com

03-20-2010, 08:06 PM	#2
Snagged Line Senior Member Sailfish Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 1,788	RE: Land of the Free?? Sounds like you have CRIMINAL TENDENCIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (damn i wish i could spell) Thanks for the information posted, I "may" have commitied a crime or two myself............maybe your new friend was picked on for being a nerd in his youth???????

03-20-2010, 08:30 PM	#3
Kim Senior Member Sailfish Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,362	RE: Land of the Free?? Sorry you had a bad experience. Just take the high road in life and treat them as you want to be treated, maybe it will rub off on them and they may be nicer to the next guy. Like the old saying goes a few rotten apples in the barrel. Don't let one person who doesn't treat you with the respect you deserve while enjoying our national resources spoil it for you. Best thing to do is file a complaint about the person's treatment of you, especially since you know the individuals name. FWC has a site of their own for this be it a good or bad input, I'm sure the national parks service has the same thing.

03-20-2010, 08:41 PM	#4
Telum Pisces Senior Member Blue Marlin Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 4,608	RE: Land of the Free?? Pickens has went to the birds. Literally. I think 4 years without people having access has got the rangers worked up that they now need to deal with people. That place used to be a place to go relax and enjoy. Now you have to worry about every tiny little rule out there or they will fine you. And they will be rude about it a lot of times if you even ask why. It is no longer a place to enjoy like we did in the older days. The rangers out there have gone nuts. It's like they do not want people to be out there and to enjoy everything that the park has to offer. They are too worried about camper tires being 100% on the asphault parking spots etc... and other stupid crap.

03-20-2010, 08:51 PM	#5
choppedliver Senior Member Sailfish Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 2,393	RE: Land of the Free?? Amazing. One more thing to get me riled up about our government. I swear it's going to come down to a revolt by the people in my lifetime. Government is out of hand. Gradualism has taken it's toll.

03-20-2010, 08:53 PM	#6
Marine Scout Senior Member White Marlin Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Pensacola Posts: 2,750	RE: Land of the Free?? Sorry you had this problem, but great info!!

03-20-2010, 09:55 PM	#7
Jason Like a roach in the dark! Blue Marlin Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: In the woods, lookin' fer ticks! Posts: 5,151	RE: Land of the Free?? There are some screwey rules out there....Now the fires, I understand, since we have the whitest beaches, it would be nice to keep it that way...but there are some strange 1's out there....:banghead

03-20-2010, 10:32 PM	#8
frydaddy Senior Member Mingo Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 192	RE: Land of the Free?? pray for another hurricane

03-20-2010, 11:01 PM	#9
mdrobe2 Senior Member Sailfish Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Innerarity Point Posts: 1,220	RE: Land of the Free?? The rangers at Ft Pickens have harassed me from time to time and I never saw what public interest they were serving. It's a shame we have folks out there earning a living off our taxes that are such a pain. Not saying they all are, just saying Matt and I both had a bad time. __________________ Mike 2009 Key West 1520 Pro 2009 70 HP Yamaha 2 stroke Garmin 540S GPS/Bottom Machine Sound by Clarion and Bazooka Coastal Night Lights Transom LED's Minn Kota Riptide Co-Pilot/Auto Pilot GPS Enabled Remote Control Trolling Motor

03-20-2010, 11:18 PM	#10
billfishguy17 Member Ruby Red Lip Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 70	RE: Land of the Free?? What yall need to do is get the name of the officers and write both of your US Senators and tell them how the public is bing treated. When the NPS get that from the US Senators they will start being courteous. But it's not until it rolls down from the top do they start to respect people. These beauracrats need to realize who is paying their salary.

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